What doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Right or not?
I saw a music video with a focus on "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger." It got me thinking. I used to believe this was true but now I just don't know.
I mean, looking back on the struggle I've gone through to help my mom with her cancer, yes - there's truth in this cliche. One must never give up, no matter how hard it becomes. As long as you're alive, you have to fight. No matter what. On the other hand, it's much harder to cling to those words when we're in the thick of an issue.
But that's just my humble opinion. So, what are your thoughts on this? Do you agree or disagree?
Take care!
Comments
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Hi there,
Actually, for me it's feeling more vulnerable but at the same time stronger. I know if it comes back I will believe we will get it all and that will be that--I'll use my strength for that, hopefully--but it will exacerbate my vulnerability at not feeling being able to completely trust my body as I did before I was dx.
Claire in AZ
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I find it more of an anger that developed for me. I took care of myself. Didn't drink or smoke. Excersised like the wind and then blam de novo out of the gate. Stage four! The day I was diagnosed I ran six miles in an hour. I agree that your ideas of trusting people change. But mainly it's my own body and mind some days I don't trust anymore. I don't think of anything as being innocent or pure anymore. Everyone is vulnerable to sickness. It's just so damn hard to live through it daily. But always listen to your body. It talks if you listen. I think cancer is a shit stew plain and simple! ~M~
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Interesting topic.
Micmel, forgive me if I put words in your mouth or assign to you something that is totally off base. But I got a sense when I read your post. You reminded me of my husband. He dedicated himself, heart and soul, to a job, for over 20 years. He was there early, put in overtime hours to make sure all systems were up and running, he was the last to leave every day for making sure that everyone had what they needed. He was mentally engaged with that place 24/7. And he believed that by doing the right thing, being the dedicated and devoted worker, that by putting his job first above family and all other life demands, he would be rewarded with a bettering financial situation and security. They fired him. I spent the next 3 years listening for the sound of the shotgun being taken from its place behind the freezer because he was suicidal. He lost his mind. He went off the deep end. It was years of hell because he could not reconcile his mind with a new truth: That you can do everything right, everything by the book, follow the rules, go above and beyond and bad shit can still happen to you.
I used to have a cookie cutter religious belief. Insert prayer, out comes answer. That bad things happened to other people because they weren't living right. My charmed life was due to god rewarding me for having the correct religion and other people, with worse lives, well they had the wrong religion, duh, obvious! My little happy house of cards fell apart for me in my early 20s and it was a devastating time. I thought I would eventually replace my lost certainties with other certainties. I waited for a new and better religion to rise up out of the ashes of my shaken and destroyed beliefs. It never happened. I never had that arrogant, smug and ignorant certainty again. Instead I was left humbled, vulnerable, betrayed and completely clueless. I remain so to this very day.
Micmel, I heard pain and anger of betrayal in your voice. It is hard to get this disease and not feel targeted. But I think that has to be the feeling of every person in a doctor's office who gets life changing bad news. A cosmic kick in the gut. My husband has never found his footing again.
I used to believe that god loved me and had singled me out for his special plan, blah, blah, blah. That was the party line of my religious start in life. I think the ONLY good thing to come out of that belief collapse is that I have NOT asked the question: why me? Instead I have been able to say, why not me? What's so special about me that cancer should happen to other people but not me? I was surprised, saddened and terrified. But I did not have that feeling of betrayal because a very long time ago I had battled with the universal truth that Bad Things Happen To Good People (a book by that name written by Rabbi Harold Kushner is a must read!)
No. I do NOT believe that what doesn't kill us makes us stronger. What doesn't kill us simply doesn't kill us. Sometimes we are improved by adversity, sometimes we are confused and terrified and other times, well, it does kill us. Bad luck does not have to make a super hero out of us. It just makes us ...people. United by the fact that we are all subject to bad beliefs that set us up for failure and bad luck that sets us up for the same. Or good luck. We can have that too. I hope we all have more of it. I agree with you Micmel, shit stew.
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No and no again. Some times it damages us irreparably without killing us. The other saying that really ticks me off is "God never gives you more than you can handle." Tell that to the families of all the suicide victims. Ugh.
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I did an art piece once with a picture of Humpty Dumpty with the caption of : "what doesn't kill you can still really screw you up." Some days I feel like Humpty Dumpty
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That German philosopher that first said "What doesn't kill us make us stronger" sadly went totally insane.
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Not Broken, that made me laugh out loud! Karma! Take that, you philosopher know-it-all! HA HA HA!
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I was recently accused of taking out my anger at cancer by not rolling over during a difficult patch in a relationship. I'd say that comment made me angry. Very much so.
I don't feel like a fighter, a warrior, or even brave. I feel tired, a little sad, and a little anxious. Cancer has not made me a better person. It's made me more tolerant and patient in some ways. Much less so in others. I have less ability to put up with BS for sure.
Chemo and BMX are already becoming distant and bad memories. I can't even imagine what some people go through that "doesn't kill them" in the end. I don't feel stronger, but perhaps more wise.
I lost my faith for the most part quite a while ago. There have been times that I wished that I had that to hold on to. But mostly I now feel like it doesn't serve a real purpose to me anymore.
For those that do feel stronger - good for you! Truly. I wish I had that confidence.
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I found your topic interesting. It took me over 6 years from diagnosis to realize after BC I am stronger.
Certainly, I did not feel stronger for a very long time and just when I was feeling slightly stronger, my mom was diagnosed followed by my sister. Three of us with breast cancer (our core family) in 3 years. Previous to my diagnosis, my beloved father died of pancreatic cancer.
Many times I thought I would collapse. But now I can say through it all, I am stronger.
The lessons of cancer unfold slowly and as they do, much wisdom comes.
As for faith - no longer do I see God as some sort of magician. During cancer treatment, all I could do was picture Jesus sitting in the recliner across from
my couch just quietly sitting next to me. I couldn't talk with Him or pray to Him, I just knew he was present. My faith is more my now recognizing His presence.
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those songs are meant to be inspirational!!! I think they are at times. I listen to mandisa unfinished! It resonates in my soul!!! God is not finished with me. He's still working on me!!! So I know that I have a mission to complete!!!
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I truly hope this won't offend anyone, but several years ago I saw a poster that really tickled my funny bone. It was supposed to be a funny twist to that very quote "what doesn't kill you makes you stronger"....and it was done in the same style of those inspirational posters that are so popular. It said, "what doesn't kill you, just delays the inevitable". It made me laugh out loud, and I've never forgotten it.
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Yeah, I didn't feel strong for a while there. Breast cancer took so much from me. But BC wasn't our first rodeo. Nope. We've been fighting one thing and another for 20 years. The birth of my youngest son, who had global developmental delays and is today much like a 1 year old (at age 22.) I thought that was the worst thing that could ever happen to me. Then my DH became disabled. I thought that was pretty bad, but having had my son I had already walked through the valley once so it wasn't such a shock. Then my older son had his first psychotic break; he was eventually diagnosed with bipolar disorder. By that time I had gotten a grip on things and rather than being swept away with fear and grief, I found my sea-legs. Good thing, because it was the beginning of a long line of difficult situations. When breast cancer showed up, it was just one of the many. It knocked me down for a moment, but now I'm back and I'm kicking ass.
I don't have any particular advice, really. Breast cancer sucks and all of us come away from it with different experiences. I DO feel stronger now, in that I'm much less inclined to go along with things I don't want to do. I'm a LOT less likely to put up with bullshit. Breast cancer tried to kill me. It failed. Although I lost my hair, my breasts, and my reproductive organs, I still WIN. Breast cancer does not OWN ME.
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I disliked the "warrior" platitudes. I didn't not feel like a warrior and I hated pink anyway. Now I hate it even more.
I too hated it when people would say "you're so strong; you can fight this." Millions of strong people die from cancer, my late husband did in '96, and I was his primary caregiver at age 35. So I had a track record of what could happen already.
I felt singled out, alone, and scared/angry for a long time. Not strong or warrior-like.
Now I'm still scared, but I am better equipped to understand why all of a sudden I feel anxious for no reason and what I can do to relieve the anxiety. It works most of the time.
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Interesting.
Cancer definitely took things from me in more ways than just physically I've never regained. I would not say in general that I'm stronger.
On the other hand, when I found myself in position to be a whistleblower, I wasn't afraid of that. I kept thinking, "What's the worst that could happen? They're not going to kill me." After a few years of wondering if I would die quickly, the possibility of getting fired just didn't seem like that big a deal. So yes, my courage is stronger.
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I think in certain ways it's made me stronger, but then more vulnerable in other ways. I fear the worst case scenario more than ever (didn't know THAT was possible), because it's already happened. But then I can look at the low points of that experience and remember that I got through that moment, which has helped me in other moments. Like, yes, I'm in a bad situation now, but at least my skin isn't sloughing off and sticking to my bra because of surgical glue allergy. LOL. I think as a person I have been changed for the better in certain ways, but I still wish I hadn't had the experience, and I sure hope it never comes back.
What I don't like is the comments about how brave I am. I'm not. I'm the biggest wimp out there. Just because I had cancer doesn't make me brave. I didn't have a choice to be brave or not, just had to get through it. If people saw how I cried in the shower every day for a good month or so, or how I had a panicky meltdown during the middle of my wire placement (really should have been sedated), or how I turned into a crazy person when the rad onc wasn't helping like they should have been, I wouldn't have been labeled as brave.
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Yeah, the brave comment. It sort of places you in the position to have to meet someone else's expectations of how you ought to behave. I do not feel brave. I feel flung overboard. Someone pushed me off the top deck of the cruise ship and I am splashing around, trying to keep my head above water, trying to not get sucked in the undertow. Meanwhile some asshat is up on deck shouting how brave I am. I don't need your admiration! I need a life preserver! Throw me the damn rope and shut the hell up about bravery. I can be brave as hell and drown anyway!
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runor - Absolutely! Your comments made me smile!
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This is a great thread. Yeah, the expectations of others. Ick. And I have, in the past, used the "what's the worst that could happen to me?" position too. Like on a bad hair day. "Well, at least I have hair", remembering what it was like not to have any. At all.
Claire in AZ
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Cancer has killed some very strong women (people). It isn't about weakness or strength.
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simone 22 - you say: "One must never give up, no matter how hard it becomes. As long as you're alive, you have to fight. No matter what."
I have had the honor of seeing some amazing women on this website who made every effort they could to recover from cancer. They explored all treatment options - took the best care of themselves that they could etc. but at some point it became evident to them that they were not going to be well again. I am in awe of their ability to stop struggling against the inevitable - to enjoy what time they have left with their children and families and die with grace and acceptance.
I don't think any one of these women was weak. I think they were strong in a very special way.
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"One must never give up, no matter how hard it becomes. As long as you're alive, you have to fight. No matter what."
This kind of attitude that is pervasive in our culture is one of those shallow attitudes that drive me crazy. It's not that simplistic as people would like it to be.
Like Bounce and other have said, I have seen very strong women fight as best they could and still die and approach death with a great deal of grace and acceptance. Cancer is a disease, not an attitude. Often times, cancer prevails.
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It’s kind of like when you hear people say someone beat this because she “fought hard” and “refused to give up”. Well no sh$t. The women who die from this disease do the same thing, but simply aren’t as lucky. It must take such courage and heart to come to the decision to die with grace or to stop treatments to feel well during your last days, weeks etc. I agree that attitude of you must fight is shallow and even disrespectful, but comes from a place of misunderstanding
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Bears! Lol - that made me crack up.
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Had a friend pass from BC and she asked that none of us say "after she battled breast cancer"....For her, it was never a fair fight to begin with. Her cancer was so aggressive (most aggressive I have ever seen over a decade + of being here) she never really stood a chance.
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hello yes I agree it makes u stronger. I am now a 24 yr Survivor this yr Praise God. I decided to fight the good fight for my life thru Faith Positivity n Family. msphi idc stage2 0/3nodes Lmast 3mo chemo before before and after surgery got married then 7wks rads and 5yrs on tamoxifen
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This may be my favorite thread thus far. Thanks for the beautiful question and the wonderful responses. I loved every entry so much.
BC makes me feel weak and afraid and anxious and more than a tiny bit of a hypochondriac. Uggh.
But then I sit with a friend and listen to a rant or a litany of bulldinky complaining that he / she thinks matters......and I realize that I have changed so much! Most of this crap is inconsequential.
One colleague complained so profusely about dumb things that I told her I would take her down to the waiting room of the radiation center at NYU (where I was treated - so professionally and so kindly) to take a look at the faces of people with real issues to cope with. Blank stare - but no more complaining
I will never forget the first time I walked in to that waiting room. Such good and loving faces — and so much suffering. My Mom wisely said that many people would recover. Still, and I know you know what I mean here, the fear and the worry and the suffering! I was never the same after seeing that - and realize the only people who truly get it are those who have had to cope with illness in a serious form.
So my longwinded rambling here is to say that we may not feel strong and mighty — but we know more now about life than we would otherwise and it at least gives us perspective that non-cancer people don’t have. Maybe that makes us cool warriors?
Love to all.
Love,
Belle
xx
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runor-Im just beginning my cancer journey. So far it's been 5 weeks of pure hell. There been moments when I feel like I'm completely losing control of my life and desperately looking for a life preserver. I was also a happy, healthy and confident person. Now I'm struggling to keep it together. For the most part I'm doing okay. But there are moments especially late at night where I just feel alone and scared. Reading other people's stories helps a great deal. Thanks for sharing
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What I’ve noticed since being diagnosed and going through treatment is that people love to talk AT you - listen ; not so much. They waste their words , ( and my time! ), with phrases such as, “just stay positive, you are so brave , you are my hero, keep smiling, well at least you get to have bigger boobs, why aren’t you having a double mastectomy?, I know someone else who has cancer, I knew someone who had cancer but they died “,etc . Suddenly everybody becomes an expert on breast cancer.
All I really wanted from them were 4 simple words - how can I help?
With regards to ,what doesn’t kill you makes you stronger - in relation to my breast cancer experience , I can say that it has made me stronger because I no longer take people’s bullshit and nonsense and finally feel it’s ok to call people out when they say something hurtful. It’s very liberating!
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