how about drinking?

Sadly, the broadcasts aren't archived. But we'll do it next year--and I may be on solo for a longer set this spring. Will keep you posted.

Lori, my tube of urea cream says not to put it on an open wound. If what's below the crack is still dead skin, I guess it's okay.

I'm likely not going to get caught up. Based on the party for my step mom's family and the last round of the red devil, I was out of commission on this site for a few days. And now I"m getting tired...which is kind of funny...but I have so much to do. I will try to get caught up the best I can tomorrow or Friday.

I just can't wait to see my daughter's gingerbread house. Super cute hair pics. This one she loves and did not want to take out, until she discovered how curly it made her hair.

WARNING--LONG POST (but worth it)

I love wine, but my oncologist wants me to limit it to no more than 15 oz. a week. (My FP advocates a glass of red per day...except for ER+ breast cancer patients). So instead of up to 3 5-oz glasses a week, I go for up to 5 3-oz. glasses (and if I go smaller, say 2 oz., I can have wine every day). Now, wine had been a major hobby of mine. I went to a lot of tastings and winemaker dinners, and at any restaurant more upscale than an Applebee's I'd always ask for the wine list. Obviously, I couldn't keep that up.

So here's how I handle it. First, I will drink no wine that isn't absolutely wonderful. That means not the house red or white, nor a "champagne" that isn't made exactly like the real thing (i.e., if it's not from Champagne, it had better be made by the "traditional method" of the entire fermentation taking place in the bottle in which it's sold).

Second, I treat wine as a food, and when I've finished the food with which I've paired it, I stop drinking. (That helps at winemaker dinners, at which I usually have an ounce or less per course). At tastings, I taste, swirl, spit and pour out. That's the only way I can still tell what I'm tasting by the end of the evening.

Third, I'm lucky in that I never liked the buzz. I don't like feeling out of control. I was almost relieved to get asthma, because it gave me an excuse to decline the joint when it was passed around without seeming like a prude. I wish they'd make a non-alcoholic wine that tastes good.

Now, with wine as a hobby, you might think I have more than a few really good bottles on hand, and you'd be right. I always hated having to open them when I wanted only a small glass (or a few sips) and feel compelled to finish them within a couple of days. I was letting so many really great bottles gather dust in the basement, afraid that since they were one-of-a-kind (I don't buy cases) that once I opened them, they'd be gone forever. My husband was so frustrated when he wanted a wine he could drink freely, I would say "no, not that one, it's too good."

So fourth, about three years ago (even before breast cancer) I was watching an episode of America's Test Kitchen during which they were testing wine preservation systems, and I saw an unusual device. It was an injector that squirts inert argon gas into the bottle (like those pricey "Cruvinet" by-the-glass dispensers in wine-centric restaurants), but you don't open the bottle--you don't even cut the foil over the cork (there's also an accessory screw-top for screw-cap bottles). The device has a needle that pierces the foil and the cork and injects argon when you push the lever. You pour as much as you want (might take more than a couple of lever-pushes if you want a full glass). When you're done pouring, pull the contraption out--the argon is heavier than air and completely covers the surface of the wine, and it's inert (so it doesn't affect the wine). Put the thing on its stand, and leave the bottle where you want. It can keep a bottle perfectly good for months, even years (I have a Bordeaux I opened when I bought the device). Nobody knows how much longer the wine can last, because nobody's ever had a bottle spoil with it. You can use it on a bunch of bottles, having your own by-the-glass wine bar in your fridge. (Note--you can't use it on Champagne, for obvious reasons, since the contents are already under pressure).

You've probably seen the commercial by now--it's a Coravin, available at most cookware & larger liquor stores. But back when I bought mine it was pretty unusual and available only from the mfr.'s website. I got the Model Two, which was on special for $250. (There's a newer model now that runs less than $200). You have to buy argon capsules, but each capsule yields 15 glasses. Yeah, it's expensive---but so are all those bottles in my cellar. And if it lets me enjoy them without putting me at risk, so much the better.

Of course, occasionally I will have a glass of bubbly or two for special occasions. But then I teetotal for a couple of days (easier than I'd thought). And if you're out with friends, seltzer with lime in a wine glass makes you feel like you're drinking--think of it as ultra-brut bubbly.

Good Morning, Loungettes! Happy Thirsty Thursday! Happy first day of Winter! Sunrise not for another hour. Sunset just before 4 peeyem. Looks Like more snow coming over the weekend, and possibly on Christmas Day. Definitely going to be a white Christmas here!Sadie isn't too fond of the cold, but she does get her run around in the snow time every day. Gotta supervise the neighborhood, and protect me from the evil gray squirrel!

CynCyn--Hooray for vacay! Yikes, 2 hours early for work, that's a bummer. Not to mention makes for a long day. Do you do a kind of work that can start earlier and end earlier? Great you have office space at Donese's.

Chi--too bad the broadcasts are recorded. So glad it will be next year.

Jazzy--Beautiful music!

Karen--such a pretty braid, I don't blame her for not wanting to take it out!

Bella--Welcome!The problem with drinking and bc is that the connection can't be proven as causative. Your Onc has probably given you the talk about a low fat, low meat, high veggie based diet to help prevent recurrence. The American Cancer Society sponsored a very large study that showed that following that kind of diet did not change the chances of recurrence in breast cancer compared to a "typical" American, high fat, high meat diet. So the reality is that there is no real way to predict recurrence, and no real way to prevent recurrence beyond the treatments we have now. So it comes down to your personal experience-- if you cut back or cut out the alcohol for a couple of weeks do the side effects get better? If so, it may be worth limiting drinking until treatment is over, most of the time. I wouldn't let that keep me from having a few glasses of wine at a special event or dinner out with friends. If the side effects don't ease off, then the wine isn't the problem.We can't give up everything that makes life worth living, we have to continue living, especially during the long-term treatments. In the long term, if you cut out wine and get a recurrence 25 years from now will you feel you lost out on a lot of enjoyable times? If you keep drinking and get a recurrence in 25 years will you feel guilty? Which seems like the worse scenario? Let that be your guide.

CynCyn--Here in the Lounge Donese is absolutely welcome! She has earned her membership. I'd love to "meet" her.

Lit Teetotaler's DOTD:

Good morning and thank you for your comments. I've searched for stats on the likelihood of reoccurrence with alcohol consumption and found it to be very vague. I needed to talk to real women who felt the conflicts I do. I know I'm new to this; hopefully it gets better. I hope my body gets used to anastozole. I lost my mother and sister very early to lung cancer. The last couple years have been rough. At any rate, on with the day! Happy holidays everyone!!!

Bell

NM OMG on the office worker, finding out what her husband was doing to her daughter. That 7 Swans sure looks inviting. I don't know when the last time we had any precipitation, be rain or snow. It's so dry out here. Funny that Sadie likes the snow but not the cold. My mom's GS dog just loves this cold weather. In the summer, you have to practically push him out to go to the bathroom.

Cyn, you have an early start for sure. I'm up early, by choice, but don't want to have to work that early. Are you and Donese goin to continue to live apart? I'm laffing at Donese thinking she wouldn't be welcome, of course she is! She goes by Boomer? Yay for vacations!

Sandy, I have so many other creams and ointments, I'll just use something else. I put antibiotic ointment on it yesterday. Glad you have found a way to preserve some of your "too good" wines!

Awwww Karen, her hair looks so cute and her dress…again so cute. Don't worry about catching up, just jump in. Nothing earth shattering has happened. Was that round 4 you just finished?

Hi Bella and welcome to our lounge. We have gals here that don't drink at all and others that do. I think you have to do what you are comfortable with. Cancer can come back whether you drink or not. And visa versa. I did 5 years on Arimidex, had some issues but mostly found it rather doable. I think we are all different on what SE's we get.

Holy Moly, look what the cat drug in! Wow, I thought you liked your new job…guess not! You still have to test clean even with a card? Hoping you get the new job and it's a good offer and that you like it!

Good morning Illona!

My DH is going in for de-cancering. They are removing a spot on his back that came back positive and then he has a spot just to the right of his right eye that he has to have MOS surgery on.

Frustrating...trying to post on my phone but it just wont take it....grrrrr.

Anyhows....I'm half way thru the second half of my split shift....I think I will make it. NM, We have a shift bid twice a year. This time I got my third choice which is 5am-1pm with Fri/Sat off and a split on Thursday..I prefer to work double weekends due to the 50 percent differential but there were none to choose from that had hours I was willing to work. Maybe I'll get it the next time around.

Goldielocks, the living situation will remain the same at last until she retires our forcast is 4-6 years time . We are looking to purchase a home in Florida near where I live now. A duplex would be ideal as we would be able to use it for supplemental income during season and for family in the summer.

Dorkey, Dara, I was wondering when I would see your beautiful face. I have missed you. BTW your grandson is adorable. He looks just like his mama who looks just like you.

Well, off to slay theweary travelers of IBM. Then its truly V-A-C-A-T-I-O-N.

Toodles

Bella, not to be a contrarian here, but ALL the doctors I asked told me to cut back on alcohol: the MO & FP (primary) said no more than 3 glasses (5 oz. ea) per week; the BS said 2; and my son's shrink (who is a serious wine collector) said that he bets research would eventually show that NO alcohol consumption is safe for women with ER+ tumors. (The BS' first NP said "moderation in all things;" my husband the cardiologist first said "not my wheelhouse, but don't go nuts." He has 3 drinks a DAY)!

Why is there a growing consensus to limit alcohol for ER+ patients? First, new research shows that more than 7 drinks a week for ANY woman, not just breast cancer patients, is considered "heavy" drinking. (It's not fair, but men can have 14 drinks a week and still be called "social" drinkers). Our systems, particularly our livers, can't process & excrete it as well as men's can. (Also unfair is that they can lose weight more easily than women, even those not on endocrine therapy). So instead of enough of it going into our urine or getting burned off, it goes into our bloodstream and stays much longer. We metabolize it more slowly and absorb it more fully.

Second, the theory is that since aromatase is made by the liver, alcohol could increase production of it or alter it to make it more potent than AI drugs can inhibit. Also, some speculate that it can cause random mutations--one of which might be responsible for recurrence or new primary tumors.

Finally (and this really bites), though ER+ tumors have the highest 5-yr survival rate and lowest 5-yr recurrence risk, after 5 years the recurrence rate goes up. (For triple-negative women who make it to 5--or even 3--years, the recurrence risk goes down to the "population" level, i.e., the risk of developing breast cancer in the first place). Given enough time (20-30 years), ER+ invasive tumors, even if caught at stage IA, will recur (either locally, regionally, or metastatic). But the flip side of that is that recurrence is unlikely to kill us--the overall (all-cause mortality) survival rate is exactly the same as for all women our age. If we get a recurrence in our late 70s or 80s, we are likely to die with breast cancer, but not from it.

So if alcohol increases recurrence risk, it doesn't necessarily shorten our lives (unless we drink enough to ruin our livers or die from drunk driving accidents). As Jazzy said, a "few" glasses when out to dinner with friends "occasionally" is okay--but not if we do that every day or even several days a week. How often do you care to dine out and drink, and how many glasses (how big, too)? I might have overestimated based on your original post.

My MO might keep me on AIs indefinitely, even though my OncotypeDX results (16) showed an 11% recurrence risk with tamoxifen and an 8% risk with AIs. And letrozole is considered the strongest. So far so good, but if the side effects intensify I might rethink things after 5 years--by then I'll be almost 70.

Thanks ChiSandy for your advice. I've been a heavy social drinker since I was 19. My husband and I limited it to weekends. He died after 38 years of marriage and I got into the habit of sipping wine every night, several glasses. He's gone 5 yrs now. We had a wine tasting group for three yrs., him and I took classes for several years; he started collecting wine and I've continued. Two years ago I dated a man who was on the Board of Directors for the American Wine Society. So wine had been in my life forever. At first I was resistant to change. Just recouperating from bilateral knee surgery in March, then June get the BC diagnosis. I was really looking forward to summer and my new knees. Spent the summer dealing with BC. I cut back somewhat but still drink 9-10 glasses a week. I'm always guilty, plus tons of SE from anastrozole. My radiation oncologist was my age and I related to her - she said cutting back is a step in the right direction, but I think after the holidays I'll try for 4-6 a week.im hoping my body is more tolerant since I drank my whole life. Lots and lots of changes these last 5 years!!!

Good Morning, Loungettes! Happy TGIF day! Cold start this ayem, current temp right around zero, going to go up gradually during the day, snow starting this afternoon, then tomorrow things get messy, snow changing to icy mix with up to a quarter inch ice buildup. Looks Like Christmas traveling is going to be problematic for some people. Glad I won't be out in it. Going to be work enough keeping up with the clearing off that I'll need to do. I'd rather have just snow, much easier to deal with, but since I don't get to choose, I guess I'll have to deal.

I'd like to ask for prayers and good wishes for some friends of mine. Doug and Heather run a dairy farm, and this last year expanded from organic cheeses and yogurts to include a Farm House store and café, featuring farm to table foods and also selling other locally raised/produced products. They were planning to expand next year to include a bed and breakfast in the Farm House. Earlier this week there was a fire in the barn attached to the Farm House kitchen and café. The barn is totaled, the kitchen is totaled, the Farm House store/dining room has some smoke and water damage. All the livestock are housed in a different barn and none were affected. They lost 2 commercial freezers full of organically raised chicken they were planning to sell through the winter. Another 2 freezers full of various meats (their chicken, and beef, pork, sausage from other farms)was saved and a neighboring farm gave them freezer space for temporary storage. That farm has purchased that meat at cost, and is distributing it to the community today for donations that will go back to Doug and Heather to help with rebuilding. Earlier this year they completed construction of a small house on the property where they live (closer to the livestock barns than the Farm House is) but a lot of their belongings were in the barn attic and were lost. I've been getting my milk, cream, half and half from their Farm Store for several months now, and have come to look forward to the weekly trip and seeing what breads and other baked goods I could pick up, have gotten some fantastic bacon and jams, occasionally having lunch in the café, but mostly visiting with Heather and the other staff for a few minutes. I can get everything they sell at other places, but I really like going there, and hope they can rebuild and reopen quickly. What's really sad is that Heather had just finished wrapping Christmas gifts, then took lunch from the Farm House to Doug in one of the livestock barns, and they saw the flames from there, not very long after she had left the building. The Christmas gifts were all lost. Fortunately the community is supporting them, someone already started a GoFundMe page, and other benefits are being planned.

Before:

Far left is the barn. The wood shingles is the commercial kitchen. The white house on the far right is the cafe and farm store and where the B&B was planned.

AFTER:

Dara--hard being in a slump, and so exciting to hear from a company you'd given up on! I hope the offer is a good one. No need to be furshamed of not pooping in, just don't go that long again! You know we can help, and if not help at least keep you company whilst you dwinkies!

Bell--Yup, the stats are very vague and the conflicting feelings can be very strong. In the end everyone has to do what is best for herself, and then continue to live life. So sorry about the loss of your mom and sister, so not fair. It does get better with time.

Illi--glad you found a balance that works for you!

Goldie--It's been quite a year for the office worker and her family. Fortunately she is doing very well and so are the kids. Snookie was the same way, loved the cold and would lie on the deck in a snow storm and turn into a snow dog. Love the way you say DH is going for de-cancering! Quite the turn of phrase!

Jazzy--great advice for Bella!

Cyncyn--those sound like crazy hours to me, but if they work for you, so be it! I can see wanting the weekend hours if they pay so much more. The duplex idea sound perfect for you two.

Awww!

Goldie--no particular plans for Christmas Day at this point, if the weather is good I may go to Mom and Dick's. Mom and I used to watch White Christmas every year, haven't for many years but she bought a DVD recently so we're going to resurrect the tradition. White Christmas, popcorn and hot chocolate!

Lit Teetolar's DOTD:

Actually, we celebrate both holidays--Bob is Catholic. So we do the menorah and the tree, the fruitcake and the latkes. Gordy saw Leslie off to the airport this morning, and he's already missing her terribly. He's flying down to Houston next Fri. and will stay with her parents (whom he's never met).

My tumor was Luminal A. Ki67 wasn't reported--my MO says with Luminal A cancer it's not really predictive. I was actually more highly PR+ (97%) than ER+ (75%).

Kim, so sorry about your friends' barn. Hope they are able to rebuild.

Tonight we went to see The Darkest Hour, about the beginning of Churchill's tenure during the bleakest part of early WWII and how his enemies in his own party were pressuring him to negotiate with Hitler (with Mussolini's foreign minister as "intermediary"--as if). It ended with his changing Parliament's (and King George's) minds and the start of the civilian-boat-aided rescue of most of the British forces from Dunkirk. It put the movie Dunkirk, which we saw this summer, into greater perspective. Performances were marvelous. Afterward we went next door to Terra & Vine, where we had a lovely 2016 Vermentino (white) from Tuscany along with our very late dinner.

NM, how devastating for your friends. Glad nobody was hurt and hopefully they can rebuild. Do they know what started the fire? Such a beautiful farm. I totally disagree with places such as hospitals and what not are demanding you get a flu shot. NOBODY should be demanded to do such a thing. And if you don't, you lose your job. I could see a law suit over that one. I am also with you on all the testing. I don't recall getting any of those. I did ask about the BRCA, but they said I was too old. It was more for younger women. And there was no cancer history in my family. And like you said, can't go back.

Jazzy, enjoy your "ME" time away, which we know you will! And no flu! Don't blame you for taking the social media break. If I don't have time while away, I don't worry about it. But if I find I have some extra time, if nothing else I will at least read.

Will be planting tomato seeds today and packing for our little get away on Monday. Hoping to go by one of the houses that was on "The Great Christmas Light Fight" and won, in Scottsdale AZ. And I think I told already, seeing Star Wars at Imax in 3d on Monday when we get there. Gonna shop for a desk for in the house.

DOTD: with eggplant Parm over linguine at Cellars, a 2014 Jovino (Willamette Valley, OR) Pinot Noir.

Lazy day today...well, not that lazy even though I stayed in till dinnertime. Slept till past 11am because I not only went to bed late (almost 4am) but was awakened several times during the night: first a calf cramp in my L leg; then two excruciating dystonia attacks in my R--from the bottom of the quad, down the shin to the foot to the toes--splaying and the big toe dorsiflexed. All I could do (besides whimper) was walk around cursing, and take a Lyrica--since it's a nerve problem causing those muscles to contract spontaneously and repeatedly--I could see them twitching. Before the Lyrica kicked in I had the second attack. When it subsided I went back to bed--it was past 6am. Would have slept till 1pm but the kitties needed their wet food, Bob had gone to work, & Gordy was asleep.

After brunch (an egg Benedict with low-carb toast instead of English muffin and prosciutto instead of back bacon, I went down into the basement to try, per Bob's request, to find some white wines I felt were okay for him to drink in quantity. Well, I discovered to my chagrin that except for a couple of bottles, most whites on hand are either sparklers (waist-deep in bubblies), a bit past prime, or waaaay past prime.

However, we are swimming in reds--high-end 1980s Bordeaux that will mature long after we're dead; various Italians; and mostly upscale California Cabernets & blends. Couple of RIojas; and an array of California, L.I., MI & Washington Pinots, Zins, Sangioveses, and blends. Not to mention dozens of excellent "one-offs" bought at tastings & wine dinners at Cellars, including the mixed case we brought home tonight.

Then there are the um, "alternative" wines I picked up in my travels through the Midwest & mid-South: a few pretty good bottles bought after dinners at branches of Cooper's Hawk Winery (a chain of IL restaurants with wineries in their basements, making decent stuff from regional hybrids and excellent stuff from grapes purchased from OR & CA); a couple of "guilty-conscience/polite-visitor" purchases from IN and MO vineyard/wineries after visiting their tasting rooms; the outstanding Jean Farris (Lexington, KY) estate-grown Pinot Noir for which I'm kicking myself for buying only one bottle. (Pontiac Peggy, if you're reading this, the two bottles I bought at our BCO gathering at Sandhill Crane Winery in MI didn't make it through the following week--but they were delicious).

Then there are the Crown Winery (Humboldt, TN) wines bought the morning after a 2013 winery-sponsored guitar festival that booked us to play on Yom Kippur: I sang & played all day on nothing but water and the prime rib dinner I'd had before services at a lovely little local temple the night before; and at sunset after the daytime concerts I was invited up to the VIP tent for hors d'oeuvres and a tasting of locally-made wines. On an empty stomach (the pass-around nibbles hadn't "registered" yet) and after a few very generous tasting pours, it's easy to be impressed by wines one didn't think could be made in TN.

Next morning before leaving for my next tour stop I bought some of what I'd tasted the night before: Sangiovese (pretty good, actually grown on-site) to the what-was-I-thinking hybrid "Chardonelle" and tank-fermented quasi-"champagne" made from who-knows-what (and in retrospect, I'd rather not know) grapes. Next stop was a recording session in downstate IL where I stayed with my friends the engineer & his wife (vegan teetotalers), so I didn't get to taste any of it till I got home The Chardonelle was bizarre and the "champagne" (of which I have one bottle remaining) had oozed around the cork in transit--when I removed the foil capsule, the cork shot to the ceiling before I could even attempt to pull it. Its twin sits in the basement, daring me to open it. Maybe during a guilty moment as an alternative to self-flagellation.

I bet you're envisioning a beautiful well-organized wine cellar. Bwahahaha...more like three or four rickety wine racks (wood & plastic, one full-height and others half-height perched on every flat surface not occupied by spare empty instrument cases, sports equipment, old toys, retired cookware, gift wrap, and obsolete small kitchen appliances). We have two "drink 'em now" racks in the dining room. The rest of the bottles are still in boxes, boxes everywhere. There is an old fridge sitting in the back of the basement, which was there when we bought the place. Unfortunately, it's defunct, not plugged in, and full of cans of old paint illegal to discard.

So once I get the boxes consolidated and everything organized (in a manner of speaking), for my 67th birthday next month I want a wine fridge. Big enough to hold everything that needs more precise climate control than just a deep cool humid basement. Calling a moratorium on wine buying for now (unless Bob brings home some "guzzling wines" bought en route from work--he likes to keep a bottle of red, a corkscrew and a plastic glass in his overnight bag so he doesn't have to pay hotel prices when he stays over the night before an early echo-reading morning at the hospital). But this is also the week that wines arrive from various doctors' offices as thank-you-for-referral gifts.

Yikes--1 am already? Gotta gift-wrap Gordy's books and Bob's Scotch before they discover them!

Celia, I'm the same as you in regards to flu shot. I have never had one. As for my skin, it's a chemical reaction from the chemo drug I am on.

Sandy, I feel ya on those leg cramps.

Kim, glad you don't have to go anywhere and I hope it clears up if you plan to go and see your mom and Dick.

We are leaving tomorrow morning, movie is around noonish, 4 hours to get there.

Wishing all of you a very Merry Christmas!