Recurrence and metastasis numbers?

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Tom1981
Tom1981 Member Posts: 52
edited October 2017 in Stage III Breast Cancer

So I know the 5 year numbers. Does anyone know what the successful lifetime cure rates are for breast cancer? What I mean is, say there are 100 stage 3 women. Statistically, how many will never have to deal with the big C ever again? From the numbers I've seen am I correct in saying there is about a 70% complete cure rate?

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  • muska
    muska Member Posts: 1,195
    edited May 2017

    Where did you read that stage 3 has about a 70% complete cure rate? I remember that a 5 year relative survival rate is about 70% at stage 3

  • sksmaw
    sksmaw Member Posts: 1
    edited May 2017

    Did you have reconstructive surgery before your radiation

  • Tom1981
    Tom1981 Member Posts: 52
    edited May 2017

    I guess I meant 30% chance of recurring seems to be about the normal number once the standard treatment protocols have been completed.

  • TectonicShift
    TectonicShift Member Posts: 752
    edited July 2020
  • Kicks
    Kicks Member Posts: 4,131
    edited May 2017

    I haven't seen the 'Stats' you have, but the type (IBC, IDC , ILC) comes into play every bit (or more so) than the Stage alone.

    All types of BC are not the same - we are each individuals within those different DX s. The 'Stats' are not the same for any type. IDC is by far the most common, followed by ILC with IBC being only between 1% - 5% of all DXd types of BC.

    There are so many different things that come into play. For me - being Stage IIIc IBC, when I hit a year post DX, all my Drs told me they never expected me to make it a year. The 'Stats' for making if 5 years lumped together for 'BC' are 87%. But for IBC are 1 of 4 will make it 5 yrs (25%). Well, next Aug, I'll be 8 yrs since DX and still NED.

    The Stage is certainly part of the DX, but only part of the DX.

    I've never heard, anywhere, that there is a "complete cure" for any BC.

  • Tom1981
    Tom1981 Member Posts: 52
    edited May 2017

    I'm not saying I've seen a definitive complete cure number. I guess my worrying started looking for answers no one truly has again. Sorry to create a stir. Just having a crisis of faith.

  • TectonicShift
    TectonicShift Member Posts: 752
    edited July 2020
  • Kicks
    Kicks Member Posts: 4,131
    edited May 2017

    "70% complete cure rate" (Your OP before it was edited) Please post the places that you found that there is ever a 'complete cure' for any type of BC - especially ones who are Stage III.

    Also 'lumping' all Stage III together (forgetting type) is the same as not taking ER/PR, HER2 status or genetic issues (not to forget age and health) into consideration.

    There are no ABSOLUTELY no guarantees as to what will happen the next minute, or at any time in the future.

  • TectonicShift
    TectonicShift Member Posts: 752
    edited July 2020
  • Artista928
    Artista928 Member Posts: 2,753
    edited May 2017

    I just have to comment on the word "cure." There is no cure period. The only way we know that what we did in our txs cured us is if we die of something else. Otherwise like already said, it's a crap shoot. I mean Stephanie who passed in Jan I think it was was 25 years stage IV! Wow. Then you have DCIS, small tumor, no lymph nodes involved profile that looks 'great' and a few years later you see they are stage IV. There are some people who eat healthy, diet, exercise and become stage IV and the reverse too where they eat all crap, do everything 'wrong' and they live many many years. That's why there is no cure. It's a tricky thing and there is no real rhyme or reason. Personally I don't believe there will ever be a cure. Maybe some form of cancers but not all. My wish is they'd take some of these money for finding a cure and put it toward finding easier txs than chemo and rads. Immunology seems to be coming along but it seems it's a long way to doing away with chemo and rads.

  • Kicks
    Kicks Member Posts: 4,131
    edited May 2017

    I have read somewhere' (don't remember the site) that once a DX of BC no matter how you die ' you will be added to BC 'stats'. In other words - if I get hit by lightening while riding my few spot App. gelding because I was DXd 7+ yrs ago (and still NED), my death will be added to the 'stats' of BC deaths.

  • Traveltext
    Traveltext Member Posts: 2,089
    edited May 2017

    Kicks, not sure all countries record deaths from other causes as a bc death. I've seen a few death certificates and your lightning and riding death would be recorded as "accidental".

    Tom, it's best to forget about the stats and take heart that the comprehenhsive treatment that I can see you've had will ensure you have very high chances of surviving Into old age.

    People freak out about breast cancer, but I reckon we've got much better chances of extended lives compared to stroke and heart attack patients. Even in Stage IV, treatments these days can easily give an extra five yers with, admittedly rare, examples like Stephanie getting way much longer.

    My gripe with the pink charities is that they pretend there's a cure as a fundraising gimmick to support bloated staffing levels, and sometimes fifty percent plus goes in keeping the charity afloat. Then they bang on about increasing awareness, which is already at high levels for women, if not men, and the change they have at the end of the day is given to trivial research projects that are being duplicated in institutions around the world.


  • Tom1981
    Tom1981 Member Posts: 52
    edited May 2017

    Sorry to stir the pot here ladies and possibly gents. Really wasn't my intention. I just freak out so much. My wife had a really rough upbringing. She fought hard to turn into the well educated and successful person she is all while still putting everyone else before herself. By my own nature, I'm a fixer of things and broken people. The mentally broken for the most part I mean. It's hard when you have no control over things such as this. I wanted to give her everything she's ever wanted because of what she had to go through growing up. Marriage, children and a better life. Then two months into marriage she gets diagnosed. After that she gets told babies the natural way probably is not going to be an option. There have been hiccups and scares through her whole treatment. (A spot on her hip that ended up being nothing, unclear deep margin after mastectomy, an IM node near her heart lighting up on a PET scan once) Nobody knows what's going to happen and no one at all deserves to go through this but when I think about someone who has had a hard life and deserves to get a break for once, no one comes to mind more than my wife. She's a hard fighter and most times she's good. It's just hard to watch when the "give up" part of her comes out. I sit here balling my eyes out because of this. I've begged that it be me having to deal with this and the uncertainty that comes along with it because of what she's gone through. My faith has always been a bit of a roller coaster but I find it incredibly hard to believe in a god that would let so much bad stuff happen to such a beautiful person.

  • Artista928
    Artista928 Member Posts: 2,753
    edited May 2017

    We understand, Tom. You're not stirring the pot. We are here to support and educate the best we can, and we do understand how traumatic it is for loved ones. Best wishes to your wife and all of us navigating this dreadful disease.

  • TectonicShift
    TectonicShift Member Posts: 752
    edited July 2020
  • KSteve
    KSteve Member Posts: 486
    edited May 2017

    Tom1981 - I found myself looking for my "odds" when I was earlier in my diagnosis and treatment. I will tell you as time has gone on, I haven't even thought of that for a long time. I do what I can to improve my chances, but I'm no longer waiting for the other shoe to drop. I'm approaching 7 years since diagnosis and life is great. Your wife is so lucky to have you in her corner. Stressing and worrying can be exhausting but I realize that turning that off is easier said than done.

    Hugs,

    Kathy

  • hopefour
    hopefour Member Posts: 459
    edited May 2017

    We're promised trails and tribulations…sadly it would seem your wife has had more then her share. But, what a complete Blessing you are by being so engaged in her care and support…this I am sure is such a witness to her of the depth of your love for her! I have a friend who's husband juices veggies, makes smoothies and walks with her each day since she ended treatment…its a joy to see. Take care of yourself as well as your wife!

  • Tom1981
    Tom1981 Member Posts: 52
    edited May 2017

    I make her fresh juice, smoothies and give her massages. Walks are coming once it gets a little warmer. Exercise will be her treatment after radiation just so we are using a weapon.

    Yes I love her very much.

    She ends radiation next Friday. I'm not sure if your hospitals have any ritual but the Cleveland Clinic used to have you ring a bell at the end of treatment of chemotherapy and radiation. Well since they opened the new center they got rid of the bell because I guess some people whose treatment was never going to end were getting upset each time they heard it. I can understand the reasoning but it was a big deal to my wife. So I contacted a local steamship museum that is permenantly docked downtown. Our family and friends are going to be hiding in the wheelhouse. When we get there she will get to ring the ships bell.

  • Micmel
    Micmel Member Posts: 9,450
    edited May 2017

    I came across this thread by accident and kept reading. I was reclassified stage III A, and I have always have considered myself stage four because it spread out of my breast and nodes to liver, A very small spot, that they ultimately ending up removing along with a mastectomy and node removal completely in my left arm. Had some AC and abraxane chemo, and it really did a number on my body. Helped some I suppose, but ended up spreading to a few places in my back and pelvic area. I recently had another scan and it's contained to the bones and no soft tissue or organs at all. I see some caretakers here and am specially interested in how you are effected and how you feel being on the other side of this horrible disease. I think I am lacking in understanding that part of it because I can't see past my own grief and sense of self loss and destruction to my physical appearance. I don't want to not be aware of how it feels to be the caretaker and view it from other views of people who are actually are on living through it themselves. I can't learn from my Fiancé, even though he is the beat in my heart along with my kids. I need to look deeper into that part of things because I don't want to not see how difficult that part must be as well. I have terrible insecurity issues since his has happened and I don't know how to even begin to have him understand how I feel such a sense of loss like I've already been given the exact day of my death. I'm not living life at all by any means. I'm mentally suffering with loss and I am a broken woman. None of this is easy or makes any sense. ~M~

  • Tom1981
    Tom1981 Member Posts: 52
    edited May 2017

    I think that like everything else it is unique to the situation. My wife apologizes for a lot of things that don't matter to me. Her being well is what matters. I try and be as strong as possible for her but it is hard on this side as well. Don't misunderstand me, it has to be way worse for the her but of course it takes it's toll.

    Look at this way, we had a friend kill himself because his wife cheated on him. He didn't wake up that morning thinking it would be his last. You have to try and make the most with what you have. You don't know your day. You might have an estimate or you might beat every odd but you don't know. It's hard but you have to make your days good because what if you wake up 10 years from now still alive thinking back at all the time you wasted worrying.

  • Micmel
    Micmel Member Posts: 9,450
    edited May 2017

    I agree with that completely. I just don't know how. I'm stuck in this wormhole and I don't have. A ladder out. I've seen so many stories of couples that loose each other and the marriage during something like this and I've already been deserted by most of my family, I just don't want to do the wrong thing and say the the wrong thing to make him leave me. I have no self esteem or even clear thinking sometimes it seems to answer a completely logical question. I don't want to loose myself either and I'm starting to think that is what has happened. ~M~

  • SSInUK
    SSInUK Member Posts: 245
    edited May 2017

    In terms of the stats - the only positive way I can get my brain to deal with the numbers - which I believe are sadly worse than 70% for some of us is to work the margins: bisphosphonates reduce risk by x%, exercise by x%, dropping alcohol by x% etc - to give one a sense of some influence over the odds. What else can we do? Tom, I see how your wife's bad luck breaks your heart - but she has you and that is a gigantic piece of good fortune and a life blessing, whatever life throws at you. I say that with feeling as one who went through this as a single mum.

  • YATCOMW
    YATCOMW Member Posts: 664
    edited May 2017

    We live in a great neighborhood....very tight knit community of neighbors.....when I was diagnosed I am sure everyone thought with my stats that I would be the first one to go.....I was diagnosed at 46.

    Instead....over the course of the last ten years........one neighbor at 55 died of a heart attack..........one neighbor died due to complications with diabetes at 53......one neighbor died of leukemia.......the other has early onset Alzheimers and moved into a facility..not sure if he is still around.

    It just makes you realize that really......none of us know......I am sure all of the above thought they would outlive me by years......instead this month I will hit 13 years with the worst possible prognosis out there. It's a crap shoot. .....All we can do is live every day the best we can. We do get a unique perspective over our mortality (along with the fear).....it should just make us try to make each day count.

    Your wife is very lucky to have you. Your quest to find those answers.....we've all searched.....when can we actually breathe again? When can we be sure we are "done"? Unfortunately they just aren't there. I say plan your future.....make big plans......push this cancer behind you.

    Jacqueline

  • Micmel
    Micmel Member Posts: 9,450
    edited May 2017

    ~Jacqueline awesome thing to read my friend. I live in a tight community as well and I am sure they all think that when I go jogging by them on the side walk or outfor one of my brisk walks. I guess ill just have to keep fighting. I love my family way too much to give into something as shitty as cancer! Thank you for sharing your uplifting And very happy post, may godcontinue to bless your wonderful progress. I was diagnosed at 45,and I'll be 47 next week so I'm trucking alongside you. Gentle hugs and thank you again. ~M~

  • Newnorm
    Newnorm Member Posts: 100
    edited October 2017

    I love your posts Jacqueline. That's the best advice. Keep posting.

  • 7of9
    7of9 Member Posts: 833
    edited October 2017

    Agree Newnorm. After a recurrence and "upgrade" to stage 3C - now NED for over 1 1/2 yrs... it's tough to trudge forward but onward I go. It seems I grasp at each 3 month checkup, only to look back and realize this bastard disease hasn't stopped me from doing 90% of what I want to do anyhow since diagnosed initially almost 6 years ago.

    On one hand I feel blessed to be relieved of that shit about "oh, I wish my child would not grow up fast, time goes too fast" while I've been desperate to get him old enough to drive before I kick off and not wreck his childhood in the mean time.

    I feel blessed because we splurged and have taken at least 2 big vacations (about to go on a 3rd) that NO WAY would we have done without cancer kicking my arse into gear to get going with life/dreams.

    This site is such a blessing to get through the tough times and the weird ones. Thank you for the inspiration, encouragement and just plain understanding that no one without cancer seems to grasp. (Well that not entirely true, have met first responders, ex military and parents of disabled kids who truly "get" me.)

  • Newnorm
    Newnorm Member Posts: 100
    edited October 2017

    7of9, well said. At the moment I'm just scared of not being around to mother my beautiful kids. Although in the main I am positive (especially around them), active, and willing my way to my next cancerversary, I do have down days and days when the fear is higher. I feel like the ocean and the waves wash in and out with the various emotions.

    I love coming to this site and wrapping myself up with all the posts from fellow BC warriors.

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