Regular Biopsy vs Excisional Biopsy? Plain English?

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breastquest
breastquest Member Posts: 52
edited January 2016 in Waiting for Test Results

Can anyone tell me exactly what the difference is? I know that excisional is taking more of the tissue, and that it needs to be done under anesthesia vs at the surgeon's office, correct? But is it a lumpectomy? Confused. Thx.

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  • ChiSandy
    ChiSandy Member Posts: 12,133
    edited January 2016

    It's a lumpectomy, but limited--if malignant, they'd probably have to go back in and take a wider margin of tumor around the tumor and biopsy the sentinel lymph nodes as well. From least to most invasive, the types of biopsies are:

    Fine-needle aspiration: for visible palpable small lumps that are more likely benign, as well as for cysts. They suck out some cells (draining an entire cyst) and analyze them under a microscope. It misses more cancers than other methods.

    Core-needle biopsy: most common these days due to its high accuracy rate and relative non-invasiveness. Especially useful for masses discovered only by imaging rather than palpable lumps (but sometimes used for those as well). The tumor is located by imaging (most commonly ultrasound but often mammogram and sometimes in the case of dense breasts MRI), the target and surrounding area numbed with lidocaine (very fine needle, takes effect almost immediately), a tiny incision made, and a spring-loaded plastic "punch" device fitted with a larger (a bit biggest than used for blood donation) hollow needle takes anywhere from 5-9 "core" samples of the tumor, which are analyzed in the lab. Both types of needle biopsies are usually performed by breast-trained radiologists rather than surgeons. Both are closed with small bandages rather than sutures or adhesives+steri-strips.

    Incisional: used mostly for palpable tumors near the surface that have a high likelihood of being benign. It is a type of surgical biopsy, done by a breast or general surgeon. A local anesthetic is injected. An incision is made and a small piece of the tumor cut out and analyzed. Mostly replaced by core-needle because of the latter's lower discomfort, faster healing, smaller incision and lower risk of infection. If small enough, closed by small bandage. Longer recovery time than needle biopsies (patients getting needle biopsies can often go back to work the same day and resume normal routines the next day).

    Excisional: the entire visible or palpable mass is removed under general or twilight sleep anesthesia by a surgeon for lab analysis. It used to be the only kind done--a frozen section was examined before closing and waking the patient, and the only way patients knew if they had cancer was if they woke up without that breast. (The norm well into the 1970s,before it was discovered that even aggressive cancers grow slowly enough for women to weigh their options for removing tumors). Except for lack of a sentinel-node locating procedure and biopsy scar, almost as invasive as a full lumpectomy and as long a recovery time. Incision is either glued and steri-stripped or sutured. Still recommended for tumors with a high likelihood of benign status and small enough that surgeons believe they can get clear margins on the first try.

    All biopsies except fine-needle can result in a seroma filling the area where the tissue was removed--nature abhors a vacuum and fills the empty space with fluid. A core-needle biopsy can produce a tiny one, and an excisional one as big as that from a lumpectomy

  • doxie
    doxie Member Posts: 1,455
    edited January 2016

    I had an excisional biopsy because of the location of my lump, right under the skin of my areola. So location is part of why you might get one over the other. The MD at the breast center wouldn't do the core-needle biopsy because he said it would cause too much pain and he couldn't get at it from another angle. Areoles are quite sensitive tissue as we all know. The doctors also wanted to do the excision instead of an incision because they didn't think it was BC, but were concerned it might be melanoma or some other skin cancer. They wanted to send the entire tumor for testing because it was so atypical.

    Because it was BC, (certainly better than melanoma in the breast!) and by my nipple, the BS went back in on a 2nd surgery, removed the nipple, more tissue and did the SLN biopsy. Somewhat a pain to do two surgeries in two weeks.

  • breastquest
    breastquest Member Posts: 52
    edited January 2016

    Thx for that description. After a standard excisional biopsy, can you go back to work, or do you have to stay home? Is the scar large or does it eventually fade like the core one?

  • doxie
    doxie Member Posts: 1,455
    edited January 2016

    You won't be able to go back to work on the same day. You'll have anesthesia, which will require someone to take your home. It somewhat depends on whether you have twilight or general. I don't bounce back very well from general, but I was back at work in three days. Had surgery on Friday and was back to work on Monday because I had to. Had to take naps to get through the day for a week, which were 10 hour days.

    When I had twilight, it didn't effect me to that degree. I was ok the next day.

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited January 2016

    my surgeon explained that they use the terms lumpectomy and surgical excisional biopsy interchangeably. I took it easy the first few days after my lumpectomy, and was back to normal activities in less than a week. I had to wear a snug chest binder (that I woke up wrapped in it, in the recovery room) for 2 days, then was allowed to remove and shower with the steri strips still on. told to let them fall off by themselves in 7-10 days, saw the surgeon for follow-up on about day 10 anyway, he removed the last of the remaining steri strips and a stitch that was backing itself out. The incision was quite small to begin with (maybe an inch at most), faded quite a bit by a year, now it's been over 12 years, and I can hardly find it at all.

    anne

  • Italychick
    Italychick Member Posts: 2,343
    edited January 2016

    the only difference between the two I think is with a lumpectomy they strive harder for clear margins, and with the excisional biopsy sometimes they are looking only to get a chunk large enough to test. But maybe ask your surgeon? I told mine I wanted wide margins, I would deal with the cosmetic aspect later on. 1.3 cm growth, 8 cm removed, and all I have is a slight ripple on the side of my left breast that doesn't even show under clothes at all. They day before my surgery, the surgeon decided to take the sentinel nodes out at the same time, and I was fine with that. So I have a scar in a crease under my armpit too. That bothered me more than the incision to remove the lump.

    My surgeon made a semi circular cut at the side of my nipple which left a very slight scar, no big deal at all. They make the cut and stretch the opening and pull the tumor out. You would be surprised how much skin can stretch. Kind of like they can pull an 8 pound baby out through an incision that is really small.

    I was back riding my bike about five days after surgery, sloshing like I had a water bottle in my breast from a seroma. But it resolved on its own. The sentinel node biopsy scar opened up and a small amount of fluid came out, but I had a stitch knot that was aggravating that area. I did my surgery on a Friday so I had the weekend to recover, and went to work on Monday. My surgeon sent me home in an ace bandage compression thing that closed with Velcro and I wore that thing and never got any special bras. Also what helped is having tank tops, like from old navy, that have spandex in them, they held everything in. The beauty of them is you can pull them on like you do pants. Worst part was everything rubbed the sentinel node scar, so if you do the sentinel node, wear a favorite top and show surgeon where you would like the incision to be. I didn't do that, and my scar is right where tank tops rub

  • kaylynn
    kaylynn Member Posts: 124
    edited January 2016

    I am glad to hear some surgeons will go wide and nodes and try to avoid another surgery. I have to have one also do to location against the chest wall and I really don't want to have it done twice.Hoping my surgeon agrees.

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