Sleeping Problems Without the DD's

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I had my BMX back on 1/11/11. Since I have so much chest pain, I rarely sleep on my belly anymore. I sleep a lot on my sides. I have noticed that my shoulders are started to hurt from crunching inward on my sides. There are no big boobs to stop the shoulders/arms from folding inwards.

I keep a pillow near me to hug, but the shoulders still hurt. I wake up so much at night from pain.It is just part of the problems.

It is not frozen shoulder. I have not problems with that.

Does anyone else have this issue?

Comments

  • bettysgirl
    bettysgirl Member Posts: 938
    edited June 2013

    i was a DD and also had bilat no recon. it does take some adjusting to be able to sleep as you don't realize how much of a cushion we had. My shoulders bother me also but more than that i seem to have more trouble with my sides hurting. It does seem that the shoulders want to roll in more. I have tried pillows but the all seem to migrate as I fall asleep. Maybe someone else has a solution that works for them..I sleep okay but cannot say that I sleep as well as i used to.

  • crystalphm
    crystalphm Member Posts: 1,138
    edited June 2013

    Yes, This remains a very big issue in my life, I sleep with a travel pillow clutched to my chest, which helps as long as I don't lose it while I sleep, but I usually lose the pillow. Sometimes when I wake up I am so very sore, and I think sleeping on my side my shoulders were almost touching in the front.

    One piece of advice I learned from here is as soon as you wake up take your small pillow or a thin pillow and put it under you right along your spine and lay flat on it for a few minutes. The pillow makes my shoulders start to stretch back down to the bed and it does help.

    But I wish I had a soultion so I didn't wake with so much pain.

  • Erica3681
    Erica3681 Member Posts: 1,916
    edited June 2013

    I just received an email, through BreastFree.org, about a new product for women who have had breast surgery. It sounds as if it's addressing the sleep problem you're having. It's called Comfort Cushion, out of the UK, but I think they ship internationally. Here's the link to their website. www.comfortcushion.co.uk. I would love to hear whether you think this product could be helpful.

  • cinnamonsmiles
    cinnamonsmiles Member Posts: 779
    edited June 2013

    Thanks for the suggestion, Erica. I checked out the comfortcushion. I don't think it will be good for sleeping for several reasons. It has the then strap on it like a purs would. When I am having lots of pain, I am all over the place when I sleep. I would be afraid I could be strangled by the strap. And since I roll from side to side, IF it even stayed in place I would need two, so double the chances of strangulation. They are small and won't stay in place. It is no different than me hugging a pillow when I sleep and to me, is safer. There are a few other reasons why, but forgot them as I was writing.

    Wearing prosthetics to bed is not an option for me because of my pain issues.

    I had my BMX on 1/11/11. I don't remember complaining about shoulder pain with sleeping until a year, year and a half later. 

  • BikerLee
    BikerLee Member Posts: 355
    edited June 2013

    Ugh - that sounds like no fun at all!!!!  I wonder if some physical therapy and/or yoga might help to rebalance your muscles and re-establish your alignment?  

    I've kind of had the opposite experience - without the weight of boobs, I find my upper to mid back is SOOOOOO MUCH HAPPIER!  

  • barbe1958
    barbe1958 Member Posts: 19,757
    edited June 2013

    cinnamonsmiles (LOVE cinnamon!!), this might sound dumb, BUT, have you upgraded your head pillow recently?? The shoulder against the bed needs to sink into the mattress if you are a side sleeper. If your mattress is too hard, your shoulder won't sink in and your body will rely on your pillow to give the proper spacing between your shoulder and ear (think of holding a phone in the "crook" of your neck). 

    So, you have a couple of options; get a very good pillow for a side sleeper (you might have to pay more, but it's worth it!), get a new mattress (and boxspring!! 60% of your weight goes into your boxspring, so if your mattress is bad, your boxspring is 20% worse!), or consider rolling your pillow or rolling a towel under your neck/jaw when lying on your side. Any of these should keep at least ONE shoulder in the proper position and then the other would hug your body pillow for as long as you hold it. Body pillows are easier to keep track of in your bed, so you have less chance of losing it. The benefit to a body pillow as well, is that it raises your top leg to ease the stretch on the muscles over your hips (as women, our muscles are over our hips, thus the curves!). You should find that you get a much better sleep.

    Good luck!!

  • barbe1958
    barbe1958 Member Posts: 19,757
    edited June 2013

    I guess I should add, I lost just D's not doubles, but I'm like BikerLee who LOVES being flat without the heavy weight pulling on my back. I have to be a back sleeper due to arthritis in my hips, but was an avid side/body pillow sleeper for years before I got so bad. 

    I also used to sell mattresses and pillows. No, there isn't the perfect bed, but there IS the right bed for you. I qualify as a sleep expert from training and love to find these kinds of posts. I hope I was able to help you or someone else reading this thread. You should never buy a mattress whose retail price was less than $1,000 (queen or king). You truly get what you pay for!!. Anything less and you risk getting a mattress that was re-formed over an old metal spring-set rescued from the dump. Yep, it's legal. Usually an off-brand label, so I always suggest buying a good brand, Sealy, Serta, Tempur Pedic, Simmons (not my favourite!!). Spend as much as you can afford and HAGGLE the price down or wait for a sale. There is a HUGE mark-up in mattresses (but not boxsprings - go figure) so a place you trust to buy should be able to work in your budget. A $1,000 mattress could sell for as low as $5-600. That's what I meant when I said $1,000 retail; you want that mattress at a sale price.

    I hope I haven't confused you. Please let me know.

  • cinnamonsmiles
    cinnamonsmiles Member Posts: 779
    edited July 2013

    I have no problems with the upper back. I have vertigo issues so I can't lay flat on my back. And for some reason, if I don't use feather pillows, my head hurts. I have thought about getting one of those wedge pillows, but they are expensive and wonder if my head will hurt. I wake up in pain at night often from the nerve damage from the BMX and node removal.

    I noticed that after a year, year and a half, my shoulders scrunch forward and they get sore. They aren't sore all of the time, but every so often. I am a very restless sleeper. I sleep on one side, roll to the other, roll onto the belly, rarely sleep on my back. I never know what position I will be in.

    Also, I have back issues that are worse than the scrunched shoulders so the mattress is picked for what is most important...our backs.

    Biker:

    As for Yoga or PT for scrunching shoulders for sleeping is not going to solve the problem. I don't have an upper back problem. I don't think you quite read what I wrote and interpreted it correctly.

    I see a PT pretty regularly for one thing or another. He knows about and keeps track of it. So far it is not an everyday issue, and is not bad enough that warrants PT/OT (I have Medicare and I am only allowed so much in physical or occupational therapy so I have to use them wisely and carefully.)

    My SO just purchased a brand new mattress. I could NEVER afford that much for a mattress on my own. I only live on disability and a $1000 mattress is more than one month's income for me. Luckily, he could charge it and get it paid off fairly quickly, so it is not the mattress.

    It is totally due to my shoulders rolling in when I sleep. I guess there is nothing I can do to stop them from rolling in.

    Thanks for all the input.

    Ps. The name Cinnamonsmiles has nothing to do with Cinnamon. Cinnamon is the name of my cinnamon colored cocker spaniel. Years ago when I got my first cell phone (2004 or 2005) the first pic I snapped was a pic of my dog (and it is my bc.org picture). When I saved it, I called it Cinnamonsmile. It looked like she was smiling. Now Cinnamonsmiles has taken on much more emotional, loving, and multi-meanings. She makes me smile, I make her smile and so much more...

  • crystalphm
    crystalphm Member Posts: 1,138
    edited July 2013

    Cinnamon, You described it very well. It is not a pain I have every day, just some days. My shoulders are bending forwards in ways they never could when I had breasts.

    I am responding again to get this visible because maybe someone has an answer.

  • cinnamonsmiles
    cinnamonsmiles Member Posts: 779
    edited July 2013

    Oh, and the pain I talk about waking up from is a very severe pain issue from nerve damage from the BMX and node removal. I have been battling nerve damage pain from the moment I woke from surgery on 1/11/11. I am on lots of meds, have IV Lidocaine Infusions where they give a bag of Lidocaine straight to the vein every 2.5 motnhs. I recently tried a neurostimulator placed in the spine to see if that would help but as luck would have it, it actually caused more pain in areas, exhauseted my brain, and the benefits outweighed the negatives. However, it did feel nice at times no to constantly feel the ickiness on my chest, and the pain in the right armpit and right arm to the elbow. But it just wasn't a good fit for me. Both my pain doctor and I were disappointed. Anyway, that is the pain that wakes me up at night, the occasional shoulder pain is just an added thing to the pile.

    I thought about wearing a bra with prosthetics to bed, but 99.9% of the time, it is too painful for me to wear them. But for me, buying DD prosthetics is ridiculous. I hated my DDs, and love having them gone (except when I feel like fooling around once or twice a year...LOL).

    Sounds like you understand it completely, Crystal. It is only a problem at night. During the day, it is fine. Like I said, the only I thing I could think of is wearing a mastectomy bra and prosthetics at night, but that is not an option for me. Maybe it would be for someone else? But then who wants to wear a bra 24/7??

  • barbe1958
    barbe1958 Member Posts: 19,757
    edited July 2013

    Cinnamon, glad you got a good mattress (hope he got a good deal!), but you haven't mentioned the pillow you use now and whether you use a body pillow. Some body pillows are great for shoring up the back of a husband so he doesn't roll over onto his back and snore!! But have you tried one for comfort?

  • crystalphm
    crystalphm Member Posts: 1,138
    edited July 2013

    So what is a good pillow? I have tried the low cost memory foam and they are terrible...are the higher cost ones better? ($29 as opposed to $69)?

    Having a high quality foam topper on my mattress has truly helped, but I ordered it online to get a denser foam than they sell in stores. I think my density is about 4.5 or 4.6. It is about  4 or 5 inches thick, sheets don't fit as then you have to get deep pocket sheets. This is not attached to a mattress, this is a foam piece you lay on top. I wish I could tell you more, my husband found it online when I had my first mastectomy, and he doesn't remember where. So far it is doing very good after 3 years.

  • barbe1958
    barbe1958 Member Posts: 19,757
    edited July 2013

    Crystal, you truly get what you pay for in pillows!! I've paid $125 over the years for a pillow that I used for ages. It's such a personal thing that there is truly no right or wrong pillow. I just bought a new $40 pillow and within 2 weeks, what was supposed to be firm now collapses around my ears when I lie on it!!!!

    As for the foam topper, that's a great idea!! My bone growth on my spine is so bad that it feels like I'm lying on a ball of rolled-up socks! We got a 2 1/2 inch twin foam topper at Walmart and I folded it in half to lay under my upper body. It's  been wonderful!! I always have bought deep-pocket sheets but this topper makes it even trickier. Each night I have to readjust the corner as I lay on it but it's so worth it.

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited July 2013

    I love Costco foam toppers - about 4 inches thick, I think.  Maybe a bit less, but much more than the dept. stores.

    Well, I was "explanted" this afternoon - and it wasn't bad.  PS did it in her office, local numbing and most uncomfortable, but not painful at all, part was the pulling, pulling - to get the implant out.  And then it kinda "pops" out. Done.

    Oh, and my gut was SO RIGHT to have these little poached egg sized Mentor Silicone thingies out - one had cracked! And that was after 6 years. The gel had oozed out into the capsule ( sorry if this is too gory) - PS took a long time rinsing the whole capsule with saline solution to make sure it was clean.  That boob was much tighter, harder, than the other one, which had slipped nearly under my arm.

    So glad it's over.  phew!  Have no idea what it looks like, and really am not that interested.  Wearing a sports bra to have some compresion - also makes me stand up straighter too?  Hmmnnn...interesting - haven't worn this one since my exchange 6 years ago.

    Nap timeWink

  • cinnamonsmiles
    cinnamonsmiles Member Posts: 779
    edited July 2013

    I have been lookind at all these suggestions and for my situation, what I have found is that short of wearing a bra and prosthetics to bed (which I can't due do to severe pain issues), nothing will help with sleeping with the shoulders folded inwards.

    A body pillow won't work. I have tried to use pillows to hand on to. But I am a restless sleeper so a body pillow will do no good. I roll from side to side, stomach, back. I am all over the place.

    I guess if you don't have this problem you really don't understand.

    Barbe, if you had read my previous post, you would have seen what kind of pillow I can use and that it is the ONLY type of pillow I can use that doesn't hurt my head.

  • crystalphm
    crystalphm Member Posts: 1,138
    edited July 2013

    Cinnamon, I believe you are right, there are no answers for this problem. I wake up in serious pain probably 3 days a week now, it is much better than every day, but I still crunch over on myself, pillows lost, and wake up and have to slowly straighten back again.

    To me it is like the subject of Lymphedema, one of the rotten things that happens to women who have had breast cancer. This pain during sleep is the same, unknown and unexplored.

  • barbe1958
    barbe1958 Member Posts: 19,757
    edited July 2013

    Oh dear! We tried Cinnamon! I read that you use a feather pillow so I don't see what difference that makes in my comments. As for the mattress, I had suggested you get a $1,000 at HALF PRICE. Or...(same idea) a $700 mattress at half price. The point being is to get the best mattress you can afford and a $500 mattress at half price is better than a $250 mattress. Sorry you didn't get my point.

  • crystalphm
    crystalphm Member Posts: 1,138
    edited July 2013

    Barbe, Good point. I am also wondering if exercise would help...it makes sense if we make our back/ chest muscles stronger we would be in a better posture even for sleeping. It just makes sense.

  • barbe1958
    barbe1958 Member Posts: 19,757
    edited July 2013

    After receiving a couple of PMs from cinnamon I realize that she didn't really want our help, she just needs to vent. I totally understand that and am kind of sorry I've wasted my words on this thread. 

  • cinnamonsmiles
    cinnamonsmiles Member Posts: 779
    edited July 2013

    That is so far from the truth. I appreciated the comments and the help. It just appears that there hasn't been a solution that works. I have a very good mattress, I have feather pillows to sleep on (the only kind I can use), I have tried sleeping with pillows on each side of me that I can hug (but I lose them once I fall asleep. I am a very restless sleeper and roll from side to side, to the back.)

    Just because Barbe and I disagree and don't see eye to eye, does not mean I really didn't want help. I wanted to see if others had this same problem and if they had any solutions. Crystal agreed that there doesn't seem to be a stand out solution so far. 

    If you read Crsytal's comments you would see that she agrees that there hasn't been any solutions that will seem to work, except maybe getting the back muscles stronger, but I still wonder about that.

    And the shoulder pain comes and goes. I don't always feel it. My physical therapist says it may be related to the rotator cuff. We discussed it in 2012. He told me if the soreness gets worse, then he would work with me on it. I don't think it is bad enough for PT (and I am on Medicare so I have a limited number of pt/ot money).

    Thanks for all the suggestions, but as Crystal, agreed on as well, we don't see a clear cut solution to this problem right now.

  • River_Rat
    River_Rat Member Posts: 1,724
    edited July 2013

    I sleep on my back and barely move during the night but if I had your issues I'd trying sewing some straps on a pillow and "wearing" it. Or you could buy one of those kids backpack pillow combinations if the straps let out long enough.

  • cinnamonsmiles
    cinnamonsmiles Member Posts: 779
    edited July 2013

    River Rat... thank you. That is a very intriguing idea that is also not too expensive. I will start looking at stores for those and see if it would work when my shoulders start to hurt. I will check it out. Very ingenius idea!!! 

  • crystalphm
    crystalphm Member Posts: 1,138
    edited July 2013

    It sure is a good idea River, I do have one I made myself, but the straps get too tight when I roll around, and I end up still hurting. But I think Cinnamon should try it for sure.

    I have made alot of "sleeping changes" because of this shoulder/ chest pain. I sleep alone now with a body pillow, head pillow and pillow to hug. When I roll on my right, the body pillow is there, so 50 % of the time I hug that, when I roll left, well, I hope I find my small pillow, more and more i do find it.

    I also bought an incredibly soft blanket, no sheet, I just wash the blanket every other week...and I get "tangled up less" and keep better track of my pillow.

    And I sleep on the foam topper which I have said before. And...there's more :-) I sleep with a small fan on because sleeping with so many pillows makes me warm. But I am sleeping and only waking in significant pain maybe 2 days a week now.

    Barbe, words are never lost, you probably helped many readers with your very good suggestions, you got me looking for a new mattress!

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