BRCA2+ --oophorectomy question

seckel
seckel Member Posts: 3
edited June 2014 in Genetic Testing

I'm 52. I've had breast cancer (estrogen positive) 10 years ago. I received no chemo, therefore I went through menopause naturally at age 52. I'm BRCA2 +, with a variation of unknow significance (so far). On my mother's side, my aunt, and grandmother had breast cancer; my mother has colon cancer, and her grandmother had it; my maternal aunt also had lung cancer. My mother, however, doesn't have any BRCA 1 or 2 mutation. The GC concluded this must have come from my dad's side; he died 50 years ago in a car accident, so I don't know what he would have developed, but neither his 3 siblings nor their parents ever had cancer.

My obgyn is suggesting to take my ovaries out because of increased risk of ovarian cancer. On the one hand, it would be nice to get rid of most of the risks for ovarian cancer, but on the other hand, I'm attached to my ovaries because they still serve a function, namely the production of androgens, which are useful for libido and perhaps other stuff. I'm terrified I might lose my libido, apart from other potential side effects which may take years to show up, but still. 

I know that nobody can predict what exactly might happen. Research online revealed almost entirely studies that have been done on women having become menopausal through surgery, which isn't my situation. That's why I thought to turn to this forum to see whether there are naturally postmenopausal women who can share what happened with them after ovary removal.

If anyone knows of any studies done on postmenopausal women and oophorectmies, could you provide a link?

I also feel, with great frustration, that doctors, even younger ones, are so laissez faire about ripping out ovaries, as in "oh you don't need them anymore, blablabla"--well, obviously not for babies, but what about lowering risk of cardiovascular disease, osteoporosis, dementia, loss of libido etc etc ??? Even though those risks are higher when removal of ovaries or chemical shutdown happens before natural menopause, there are still risks. It almost strikes me as a misogynistic attitude, when doctors dismiss the importance of postmenopausal ovaries.

I'm not a candidate for HRT because of my estrogen receptive breast cancer.

Any input appreciated...

Comments

  • Moderators
    Moderators Member Posts: 25,912
    edited February 2013

    Hi Seckel,

    We're sure there'll be lots of help from other members here shortly. In the meantime, you may be interested in the main Breastcancer.org site's Research News on Prophylactic Ovary Removal, for lots of stories on abnormal genes and ovary removal. Hope this helps!

    --Your Mods

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited February 2013

    So are you BRCA2 positive or do you just have the variation of unknown signifigance?  I  have the BRCA2 mutation of "unknown signifigance".  My breast surgeon said she likes to treat it as if I was BRCA2 positive , and therefore thought it was wise for me to choose the mastectomy.

    I remember my oncologist saying that there are a lot of mutations on the BRCA genes, and only about 5% show a correlation with cancer.  So he said it was a 95% chance that it didn't mean anything.

    Also, I did a lot of research about the BRCA2 gene and found that the risk of ovarian cancer was considerably less significant than being positive for the BRCA1 gene.  In addition it looked like the real risks for ovarian cancer in BRCA2 didn't present themselves until later in life... like 70+ years.  I printed out the study and can find it for you if you'd like.

    Anyhoo... just wanted to put that out there.  It was frustrating researching because they tend to lump BRCA1 & 2 into the same risk category for ovarian cancer and they aren't.

    I'm 46 and premenopausal.  I'll be off tamoxifen at age 49 and will be facing this same question soon.   My onc currently has me getting an ultrasound every 6 months of my uterus and ovaries.  I know it's not foolproof for detecting ovarian cancer, but I figure they would be able to better see a change?

  • seckel
    seckel Member Posts: 3
    edited February 2013

    Susansgarden, you're right to ask: I was confused on this. I'm not BRCA+, since I only have the unknown variance. So I'm in the same situation as you in that regard.

    I get a 6 month ultrasound as well, and a CA 125; there are quite a few doctors out there that think it's a waste of time and money, but I feel the same as you--maybe they can detect a change early in the game. Plus it's my life, so there.

    If you would be kind enough to dig up the study you were tallking about, that would be great.

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited February 2013

    I will look for that report this weekend.  With a quick google search I did find this on PubMed.gov  -->  Meta-Analysis of BRCA1 & BRCA2 penetrance

    As you can see in the results and in the link to the graph..."Meta-analytic mean cumulative cancer risks for mutations carriers (which we are not Smile ) at age 70 were as follows:.... ovarian cancer risk of 40% for BRCA1 (positive) and 18% for BRCA2 (positive).

    So, as you can see in this analysis... the risk IF you were possibly BRCA2 positive is much lower than BRCA1.  Technically we aren't even BRCA positive so our risk would statistically be even lower.

    My gut is telling me to maybe wait until I am in my 60's to think of removing the ovaries.  That's when it appears the risk starts to rise.

    If you are doing the 6 month US and the CA125 I would feel pretty good about that kind of watching.  My onc doesn't do the CA125 on me.  I can't remember the reason.  Maybe he'd wait until I'm in menopause?  I'll ask next time I see him.

  • seckel
    seckel Member Posts: 3
    edited February 2013

    Susansgarden, my onc and now my obgyn have had me get a CA 125 ever since I was diagnosed 10 years ago, when I was definitely premenopausal. Wonder why yours isn't doing it. Maybe he simply doesn't believe in the value of it (Too many false positives? Not really a good tool?)

    Thanks for looking for that report.

    It's all a numbers game, isn't it. 

  • jessica749
    jessica749 Member Posts: 429
    edited February 2013

    I have a dear friend diagnosed a few yrs ago wtih Stage 3c ovarian (actually, fallopian tube) cancer. She afterwards learned that she is BRCA 2+. Her mother lived to be 96, she is an only child. While bc/ovarian lurk somewhere in a great aunt or a great grandma on her maternal side, she figured since her mom was fine she was fine.

    Okay, so maybe my reaction is emotional. I understand your concerns. They are valid. But given life death, the fact that you are BRCA 2 +, I simply cannot understand why you would hesitate on this.

    Just being honest.  I too learned I have some genetic issues I don't want to get into personally, and therefore hysterectomy / oopherectomy was offered. I could only think of my friend, her situation, and look upon my diagnosis of a chance to act on genetic information before it strikes me dead, literally, as the gift that it is. I hope you see it that way eventually too, or end up lucky like my friend's mom and against all odds do not develop disease.  

    Best wishes, it ain't easy but I am convinced one must see this bummer genetic info as a gift. Flip in upside down, inside out, and see it that way.  

  • tracker
    tracker Member Posts: 7
    edited February 2013

    Jessica749, now I'm really confused. I thought there's a distinction between being BRCA2+ and having been diagnosed with a variation of unknown significance on the BRCA2 gene. Susansgarden pointed that out above. I don't have the mutation that's commonly associated with increased ovarian/breast cancer risk. Does that still make me BRCA2 positive?

  • jessica749
    jessica749 Member Posts: 429
    edited February 2013

    I'm sorry: your original post said you were BRCA 2 +, so I took that as meaning you were BRCA 2 +.

    If you are not BRCA 2 + then you don't need to worry.  Or, if what you mean which I didn't get initially is that there is a variation of 'unknown' significance in your BRCA 2 gene then you need to speak to people more expert than this board as to how the medical cognescenti consider this--do they consider you BRCA 2 +? 

    You sound like you don't want an oopherectomy. If you are not considered to be BRCA positive then you won't need to get one. But if you are then I wouldn't hesitate as explained above.

  • tracker
    tracker Member Posts: 7
    edited February 2013

    I'm sorry for being so imprecise! I finally looked up my paperwork and figured out the mistake I made in my subject line of this post and in my thinking: I am not BRCA2+; I have a variation. BART was also negative, I just found by rereading.

  • jessica749
    jessica749 Member Posts: 429
    edited February 2013

    now i'm confused: seckel or tracker, who is the original poster? anyway, whoever, I understand the concern as no surgery, like no drug, is without side effects/etc. These vary. Horror stories can be posted and seen on internet, others who have NO problem are not heard from. Who can predict what your experience will be: we are all individuals and not even the surgeons know who will adversely suffer SE.  

    So you are right to weigh the cost/benefit analysis and I don't really know what having a 'variation' that isn't BRCA2 + means! And maybe jury out a bit, so hard to weigh unknown cost with unknown benefit.  Sorry.

  • tracker
    tracker Member Posts: 7
    edited February 2013

    I don't know how this happened, but I'm both seckel and tracker (??). 

    There are variations that are different from the one they identified as increasing breast cancer and ovarian cancer risk, namely BRCA1 and BRCA2. The one I have and many others also have are defined as having "unknown significance", which just means so far there hasn't been any evidence of their having any increasing risk effects on BC or OC, but are just sitting around potentially doing nothing bad ever.

    And yes, I know, ultimately I'll have to follow my gut, since nobody can predict what would happen after surgery. But it helps to not feel alone in this by getting feedback here.

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited February 2013

    tracker/seckel :) ~ I think my Onc did say he doesn't do CA125 because of the unreliabilty?  I will have to remember to ask.  

    It is difficult wrestling with our own minds as to what is reasonable treatment, and trying to base it on scientific evidence and not so much on fear.  I think it is helpful to "talk it out" with others on the boards because so often we are left to make the choices ourselves.

  • tracker
    tracker Member Posts: 7
    edited February 2013

    Susansgarden, in the interim I got the results of some more genetic testing. I was tested for 19 different gene mutations that are known to be involved in breast, colon, ovarian and uterine cancer. Some are involved with all of these cancers, some only with one, some with two or three. I was, thankfully, negative on every single one of them. Unfortunately I had to pay for this test pretty much out of my own pocket ($1,400), but now my genetic counselor feels ever more confident that my variant of unknown significance on the BRCA2 isn't deleterious, and that finally stopped my worrying about oophorectomy or not, at least until my variant should get reclassified. So the ovaries are going to stay in!! I feel so much better. Btw, my genetic counselor said she wouldn't put the percentage of deleterious variants as low as your onc, but she didn't give me a different figure. For what it's worth...

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited February 2013

    tracker ~ interesting.  I wonder what % she would give?

    I know I have reached my lifetime maximum for insurance for genetic testing, so if I wanted to do what you did it would be all out of my pocket too.  I think I'm just going to cross my fingers and hope for the best. :)

    I'm glad you got your peace of mind and get to keep your ovaries! Laughing

  • tracker
    tracker Member Posts: 7
    edited February 2013

    Yeah, I don't know what number she was thinking of, I didn't press her for it. 

    Best of luck with your ovaries!

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