Let's talk dog ears, kisses, bumps and dents
Overall I think my plastic surgeon did a fabulous job.
I do have a 'kiss' that when I was newly out of surgery and healing I was quite bummed about. It has been healing and getting flatter by the day. I also have the tiniest of dog ears (if I could even call them that), they are points under my arms at the back most point of each scar. I don't like them but they too are disappearing and nothing I would seek to change. I know many of us have dog ears, flaps, bulges and dings that we aren't happy about. Maybe you have come to like them, like me. I don't know, but I would like a centralized place to talk about it.
Comments
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I think this is a good topic. I am just two weeks past surgery and haven't really examined everything, but there are some hard bulges under my arms that I don't know about. I don't think I have any dog ears. I would be interested to hear other experiences.
Karen
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This is a great topic for me...I have "dog ears" slightly to the rear of my armpits and I do not like them. They have little points where the scar terminates that look like poorly constructed darts (for those who sew). I live in the southwestern US and I do not trust any of our plastic surgeons...I think my Tricare will pay to go elsewhere. Am I allowed to ask where I might look for a plastic surgeon who does this kind of reconstruction well? It would be worth it to me to have this surgery.
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I wish I understood how to upload pictures to this forum. I would show you my hamster ears.
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Hamster ears are such a nice term of endearment, MT.
I am trying to think of how to describe the extra flesh, concavity, and deformed ribs I have after undoing my implant recon. The soft, overstretched muscle and skin partly conceals how the ends of the ribs have been permanently bent outward from the pressure of the tissue expanders and implants. Depending on my posture, the look can vary. If I stand up straight and roll my shoulders back as well as I can, I look fairly flat. When I raise my arms above my head or straight out at shoulder height, everything moves freely and there is no extra skin or muscle. However, if I hunch over just a little, a "button-tuck" area becomes quite visible. So I guess I could say I have two soft button-tuck pillows on my chest. A little bit soft and cuddly but not as cute as hamster ears! I can't upload directly from my iPad, but here's a link to a pic that sort of conveys the look:
http://homeguides.sfgate.com/DM-Resize/photos.demandstudios.com/getty/article/61/182/200420265-001.jpg?w=600&h=600&keep_ratio=1 -
My left side is pretty smooth with some dog ear but my right sie is really bumpy and dog eared. Plus, it looks like I have an outline of breasts near the sternum, size AAAAAA.
I wonder if we can use our reconstruction insurance benefit for a "clean up" job?
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Tina - love the picture LOL. I could relate. I am post deconstruction...my right side is tight and very scarred from months of fighting necrosis, after that I asked the doctor to remove the left expander as well and he left the skin and fat there so it is saggy and loose. Sort of like that pillow! I am so happy to be done with surgeries I am trying to just love my chest just the way it looks. Not always easy...but I'm working on it.
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nibbana, I also have the curved outline of the inside of my breasts remaining after BMX. I believe the technical term is mammary ridges. My surgeon, bless his heart, didn't believe I wanted to skip recon. He thought it would help me out to leave this extra tissue, to make recon more cosmetically appealing if I changed my mind on recon, and also to give me a mini-cleavage for prosthetics which I don't wear. So I'm not totally flat in the front but he did take away the under-arm dog ears.
Someone I know got her insurance to pay for liposuction on her 'leftovers' so yes it can be done.
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My mom, who had double mastectomy without reconstruction, had revisions to clean up her dog ears and flappers. She was horrified that the original surgery had left her so ragged-looking. I'm pretty sure insurance paid for that. In fact, the surgeon who did the revisions said the original surgeon had actually left some breast tissue behind, which would have been risky.
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sbelizabeth, that's a good point. I asked my onc about the remaining tissue and he said the risk is minimal in my case. So I decided to leave well enough alone. I don't want more surgery, and I don't want to make my mild case of lymphedema worse. My scars are fading now and maybe one day just white lines. Obviously I'm not happy about losing my breasts but I'm at peace. I hope your mom is doing well today - and you too!
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Badger, I have tissue remaining too but my risk is also minimal. I had busy breasts and DCIS but all of my "stuff was always in the top portion of my breasts. What remains is a ridge along the bottom.
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River Rat, do your leftovers ever jiggle? Mine do sometimes, for example when I jog up the stairs, and I gotta say it's humorous to me. But I'm 28 months out and at a different place than many.
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Badger, yes they do jiggle a bit if I'm not wearing forms and do something like run up the stairs and I also find it humorous. I'm almost six years out and pretty much used to things as they are, pretty darned comfortable. I've had too many surgeries and don't want to have any that aren't absolutely necessary. DH and I have kind of grown attached to the little "booblets."
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I was fortunate that my breast surgeon did a very neat job. I have thin symmetrical incisions that are nearly invisible after six years, no dog ears or other ridges, lumps, or bulges. I did, however, have a small seroma (pocket of fluid) on one side that gradually diminished over a six month period until only a tiny bulge of fluid was left. But that little bulge lasted for 2 1/2 more years! I finally discovered Lebed exercises (intended for women with lymphedema) and to my amazement, within one week of starting them the remaining fluid dissipated and was gone!
However, despite having had such a good cosmetic outcome, I do have something that I'm told is common among thinner women like myself--my ribcage is very obvious. My surgeon prides herself on removing every possible iota of breast tissue and she seems to have succeeded in my case. Apparently, no fat was left either LOL. I was told by the breast oncology social worker before my surgery that this might happen in my case (she's thin herself and had had a mastectomy a couple of years earlier). I was glad to have been forewarned. It doesn't bother me or my DH, but I can imagine that seeing the outline of the ribcage so clearly could be upsetting to some.
As others of you have said, I try to love my body as it is now. Mostly I succeed. I actually like the feel of my chest's flatness. And I like the way breast forms feel against my chest and the way I can look exactly as if I have breasts, or not, whatever I choose.
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Erica, my ribcage is also very noticeable. My rad onc said it was partly because I have very little flesh covering my ribs. I like it somehow. This is how I looked as a kid, and there is some sort of odd comfort in that. For me that is.
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Jane - LOL you liked the pic! Sounds like you had a rough transition, but I'm glad everything has healed and you're healthy. While deconstructing, my PS did the best she could to avoid creating more scar tissue that would worsen my truncal LE. She said the skin and muscle would shrink over six months but I'd never be totally flat. She offered if I was really unhappy with my appearance she could fix further but recommended against because of the LE. It took at least a year for everything to shrink fully. I was so happy to be free of chronic pain that by the time six months rolled around, another surgery was the last thing I wanted. I'm just happy those foreign objects are out of my body. I never have to worry about another surgery down the road when they would have "expired." I, too, am trying to make peace with the chest I now have. It's definitely a process but seems to be easier as time passes.
I just noticed you're in Bradenton. I'm visiting my mother in St. Pete. This rain is lousy! -
badger, I really hope my mammary ridges flatten out, because I told my surgeon over and over I was waiving reconstruction. I guess I'll see how I look in a year and maybe think about a clean up job.
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Erica,
do you mean that each bone shows or that the structure of your rib cage shows above your belly?
Melly
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Tina- what a rotten time to visit your mom! Hope you're still here today when the sun finally came out after about a week of rain. Beautiful day. Sometimes it takes the rain to appreciate the sun........hmmmm.
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Hi Melly,
Not my entire ribcage, but in the area where my breasts used to be, the outline of my ribs is visible. Hope that helps.
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Right after my MX I asked one of the nurses if it was going to stay so indented. He said yes because I'm fat, tho he did say it in a much nicer way. It looked aweful! Happy to say most of it was from the swelling and it is almost flat now.
I was worried about "dog ears" and flaps from reading about them here so much, but as far as I can tell I don't have any. There is still a pretty good dent under my armpit, but nothing I can't live with. It has only been a month, so I'm hopeing that will fill in a bit more over time?
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Erica, Mine is the same, I see my ribs in the concave places on both sides. I thought it would fill in, especially since I gained weight, but it is only more pronounced.
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I see the bottom ribs stick out, or so it seems to me. I swear my ribs on the mx side are bigger than the non-mx side. I thought for a long time that it was an optical illusion, but even my bf agrees it looks bigger. I have no idea if things (fat) shifted after surgery to sit on the ribs or if I have always been bigger on that side! Oh well.
I really hoped to be smoother and flatter than I am. I bulge above and below the scar and the scar is a little zipper like. Not hugely, but enough that I may some day get it cleaned up. Or not.
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OK, so am only two weeks out from a BMX, no recon. but yesterday I noticed underneath where the boobs used to be, below the incisions, there are hardish long lumps. I have LE on the right hand, arm, breast (guess that part is gone now) from treatment four years ago and after this surgery, my LE therapist noticed swelling under the right arm from the SNB. She worked on it a long time on Mon., showed me what to do and thankfully that took care of it. Tues. afternoon is when I noticed this. Have been doing light MLD to maybe help but nothing except a little less tightness.
OK, so what I'm really worried about is tomorrow's post surgical check and that it's fluid that's hardened or something and he will try to aspirate. IT IS NOT NUMB. So, please, tell me I'm making something out of nothing more than surgical healing. Has anyone else experienced this?
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Hi, Kane - Not sure if this is what you are referring to, but some have noticed what they call a "fat shelf" below the incision area. I may or may not have this; not sure because my ribs are deformed from expanders and they flex outward there. Here's a link to a discussion about the fat shelf. It really does take a few months after a mastectomy for everything to settle and heal. The incision and external area often looks better before all the internal tissue fully heals.
http://community.breastcancer.org/forum/82/topic/582184?page=19#post_2665230 -
Hey Tina! Well after writing the post, I did the beginning LeBed LE exercises and it went down and softened. Now it's back, hard, tight pockets under where the breasts used to be. Further research and I think it's seroma and that when I go to the surgeon tomorrow he's going to drain me which I know will hurt and I'm so sick of pain. NOW I'm worried he won't do my port and if I can't have a port I don't think I want chemo. My veins are that shot. I know I'm getting way ahead of myself here but geez, it's hard not to after all my bc experience. At one point he talked about a pic in my NECK!!! I think if that's my only option, I'd consider it but holy cow. Betcha doctors HATE the internet!
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Kane, if you need info about seromas, Kira and Binney would be a good resource. I don't have any experience or much knowledge of them.
I would think if the areas are responding to Lebed, that's a good thing. My suggestion is to keep drinking plenty of water and do all the proactive things you do for LE or during a flare - minimize salt intake, caffeine, eliminate other dietary or known triggers.
Have you been able to do some walking? Even if you do short distances at a slow pace, it really helps to get up and move to promote lymphatic flow. The heat has been miserable, so if early morning outside doesn't work and you don't have access to a treadmill, you can walk in place or even walk around inside your home. Sounds goofy, but it works as far as increasing activity, and the benefit is you don't need to worry about what to wear or primping to go out.
I had the therapist doing MLD everyday for two weeks post-surgery, and she massaged right across the breast area above and below the incisions. My truncal swelling acted up for a little while because the surgery was close to it, but the MLD definitely helped. I hope whether it's seroma, post surgery swelling, or a LE flare that it doesn't affect your ability to get a port. Deep breaths and one thing at a time.
For what it's worth, I had a neck IV for my deconstruction surgery because my arms were wrapped and I had the BP cuff on my calf. I was freaked about it even though I wanted it and they gave me a sedative, but it was so much better than an arm IV. I had it in for two days and hardly knew it was there. A PICC is similar but inserted using ultrasound, yes? -
Tina, have been getting more active. Because of heat and humidity have not gone outside except for med appts. Nothing causes a flare like that combination. But I get up and walk around the house every hour. We have three floors and I go up and down the stairs, walk every room, etc. Then it occurred to me the other day...I have a treadmill (the anasthesia must have really done a number on my brain), so have started that slowly this week. I drink tons of water and count the number of times I go to pee in my exercise quota.
When I woke up this morning, the left side was soft but the right hard. I had LE in right breast and am wondering if this is some sort of strange flare. Have an LE therapy appt this afternoon. Then she's going on vacation for a week. I have another therapist, not LANA certified, who practices the Chickley method and she is great. I pay on my own to go to her when Medicare stops paying for the real thing. She does wonders. I go every two weeks, but I am going to go three times while the LANA therapist is away. Hopefully, Chickley will clear up the blockages and get things flowing again. Obviously my lymph system has been shocked fierce by the BMX so it's just a matter of telling it where to go.
I'll let you know what happens at bs today.
The thing about the PICC is it would be in my neck for more than 4 months and he said I wouldn't be able to shower. And what about washing my hair? Oh right, losing it.
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Good discussion! I will repeat what the link said (went to my comment on another thread) there is a fat shelf that 'supported' your breasts when you had them. It is a hard ridge that is built up by the use of an underwire brassiere. I was a 38D or bigger for over 37 years with underwires the whole time!! I had quite a ridge. As I said in my former post, you do tend to stand a bit different without breasts (not hunched over!) and the ridge does seem to become minimal. Mine seems a bit reduced after 3 1/2 years. When I first went back to work 2 1/2 weeks after my double mast, a young thing pushed on my ridge and said 'what's that'. She answered herself by saying 'oh, I guess a bandage'. I let her think that rather than tell her it was fat!! I think now, how rude of her to touch me!!!!
I will say, that though I've gained weight over the years, I haven't gained it on my fat shelf or breast area. That has stayed nice and stable. I even sometimes look like I have a bit of cleavage:
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Tina and Barbe, Got back from bs visit. Turns out it was my worry more than anything. He reminded me I'm a bit more than two weeks out and there is still swelling and lymphatic fluid which will take a long time to be aborbed by my body. No need for him to aspirate. Relief. No problem with port insertion, so my worry was for nothing. Everything is looking great. He's pleased, I'm pleased. No restrictions other than to listen to my body and rest when I need to. I can even drive now. While doing my MLD, be sure to keep in gentle, like I'd do anything else and doesn't he know it's a gente process anyway. Perhaps not but he's honored all me LE requests from the get go.
He said all the puckers and such on my incisions will go away in time and smooth out. I am not concerned. Forgot to ask him where the port incision would be since I'd like it to be a bit lower this time, but I'm not complaining.
Barbe, I cannot believe someone would have the nerve to touch you. Where are manners! Or honoring personal space! Astounding. I asked a couple close friends if they'd like to see. Such looks of horror that came across their faces. My gosh, I'm not a monster. I look at least ten times a day. It's reassuring to me that I look OK. And you are right about posture. I noticed my improvement from the getgo. Shoulders back, head up, stomach in. It's more comfortable and it stretches the tightness.
Got my prescription for foobs, bras, etc. Won't be using that for awhile but I have it. And now I'm going to try to stop worrying so much. Thanks for your concern, advice, sisterhood.
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Oh Kane!! All good news!! You did great to question what you were concerned about and keep those queries coming - some people lurk and don't read and your questions help them. It's nice to know you're normal, right?
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