Hats off to any that wrap
Comments
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Tina...love your ideas and comments about why it can't be LE.
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You guys are toooo funny. As disappointed as I am at my BS for saying I would not get LE, he was quite compassionate when I made a visit to his office wrapped and he said he hated to see me wrapped. I don't know if I can donate him--I do like him. But...for the cause of "Rap Rooters" I may reconsider.
I just heard on our local news that a new cancer center is opening here in Knoxville. It will offer some new kind of radiation. Instead of thinking how many people will be treated for cancer all I could think of was "oh, no, more LE". My therapist says they have been short a full time LE therapist for over a year and are so busy. Maybe we should visit schools where students are majoring in physical therapy and encourage some to go into lymphedema therapy also.
Glad we can see some humor in all of this wrapping world. Maybe a wrapping "flash mob" rather than Lebed. We can unwrap and wave in the air.
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Tina, your concept could be titled 'Wrapped: Prisoners of Denial'
or maybe:
Wrapper's Revenge
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Tina, I mean goldilocks. I am encouraged by your wrapping experiences. Keep it up. Love the new events for the olymphics. Too bad my coordination is aging as I can't swat a fly. My family laughs when I try to get that sucker dead. I would loose this event.
The jail art project is a winner. Yes Nordy is the torch bearer. She could run holding up bandages on fire! You know in real life it would be an eye opener to LE! We could visit each surgery ward because that is where all this trouble starts, right there as the Rapped Rooters touch their shiney wielding scapel. Surgeons are probably in kahootz geting kick backs with the LE supply stores! Oh but which city of denial would we pick to show our art piece? There are so many rapped Rooters to evaluate.
Going to work and trying wrapping tonight.
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A wrapping flash mob! Becky, that's brilliant! In a shopping mall, right in front of several dress shops, none of whose beautiful clothes will fit us once we're wrapped. Love it! Think it'd go viral?
We should plan it for October-- the real face of bc. Or arm of bc. Do we need music in the background?Seriously, your idea of presenting LE to PT and OT students is a real possibility. The PT and OT associations are opposed to their members taking additional training to be LE therapists and are responsible for killing all our efforts to make training requirements legally binding, so if we could reach students with the straight story early in their training maybe we could change their perceptions. Go for it!
Binney -
Sign me up for the Olymphics and the Jail Art project. I have a very well known BS that I'd love to "show off" - and let him hear the continuous chanting of "you'll never get LE".
Binney - why in the world won't the associations support additional training? I guess I don't understand that one.
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My Certified LE Guy has his Masters in OT. He got his LE Certification after he had his Masters. As far as I know none of the PT's at the VA I go to are also LE as the few times I've seen them they always check with him first.
Not ALL Drs are ignorant of LE. My surgeon and my Chemo Dr both noticed 'something ' before I did and contacted my PA to put in for me to see my LE guy. -
can't match the humor of the board, so won't even try...
Hugsz4U, it does get easier. I've been wrapping my hand 24/7 for over 4 months. I was hopeless in the beginning, but slowly I got better. At this point, I am better at wrapping me than my LE therapist is. (She's a lot faster, but I have better "results" with my wrapping.)
Here's a few tips: I find it harder to do good finger wraps with old gauze than newer gauze. So, if you can afford to, replace your gauze frequently. (Parenthetically, new gauze seems to contain my swelling better.) Second, have you tried wrapping your fingers with the gauze unrolled? Your therapist will frown and you won't win style points in the LE olyphics, but I find wrapping my fingers much easier when the gauze is unrolled. Also, remember what your wrap looks like doesn't matter at all. The important thing is does it compress adequately.
And when you just can't seem to get it right and are ready to through the whole load of bandaging crap out the window, remind yourself that it doesn't have to be perfect: even a not-very-good wrap (as long as it isn't too tight ...) is probably better than no wrap. -KS1
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Just busy here dyeing my wraps pink for the flash mob in October. Yes,can someone mention a theme song to go with the flash wrapper mobs.
I can't believe the associations are killilng LE training at the students level. So that's where the problem starts. That is so medival and not progressive.
Kicks, In all fairness my Doc's PS nurse came up to me after surgery and gave me a bunch of exercises to do and phamlets on LE. It's true, there are some aware docs out there. It was my MD that brushed of the LE subject though and laughed at me. I hope his recent surgery doesn't give him LE because he wouldn't know how to diagnose himself , he might swell up and think he licked off too much salt off his margarita glass the night before.
KS1. That is fantastic that you wrap better than your therapist. You are my mentor! Good advice given, will keep guaze fresh. I don't wrap the gauze unrolled but will try. How do you stop getting tangled in it though? Also I was worried that if my wrap turned out awful looking it meant it was not right. Glad to hear it is better than no compression.
Tina, You had a horrible wrapping session last night. About tightness. I use to knit scarves very tight and my mom said it was because I wasn't relaxed enough. I think this applys to wrapping also. I think if we are in a hurry and stressed to wrap then we get the wrong tension. I really do think a glass of wine and mood music would help. Although the wine might be hard on our LE, it won't kill us and once in a while.
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It is of course unfair to paint all the doctors and surgeons with a broad, bandaged brush, but so many posts in the LE forum mention docs in denial, that I really do think the ones with LE on their radar screens are in the minority. Kicks, thank you for reminding us to be thankful for the ones who are paying attention to LE signals and getting their patients off to a prompt care start.
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Hmmm, yes, there are some LE savvy doctors out there. But I betcha they'd be frustrated enough with their LE-stupid colleagues to help us round them up for our art installation.
PTs (and OTs to some extent) have to take a LOT of schooling to be certified as PTs. It's expensive and it takes a long time. They study a lot of anatomy and physiology. Naturally when they get done with all that they do NOT want to take more classes. And because they've studied anat they are ready to believe they know all they need to know about it.
All of us know that LE is a VERY specialized field with a whole range of variations, none of it intuitive. The skills needed to manage it (designing an effective, individualized massage routine, bandaging effectively, understanding the differences of presentation and the various body parts that can be affected, wound care, and on and on) are not the same as any other type of PT or OT. (The PT passion for such things as exercise bands, for instance, has done in more than one of the women here.) In short, WE know that PTs who have not had full LE training are as dangerous as most of the rest of the medical community. But THEY think they know enough to treat us.
And here's the critical difference between the PTs (and OTs) and us patients: they have a VERY strong lobbying presence, both at the state and national levels. So when we start to agitate for licensing standards for lymphedema therapists, they squash our efforts like a bug. That happened with the current bill that some lymphers are trying to get through Congress--it started out with a strong call for licensing standards to be set up by the states, but that was dropped (along with better education for doctors and nurses) because the bill could never be passed with the opposition of the PT and OT associations. Now the bill is strictly for insurance provision for garments. Which is a good thing, but it's not going to change the medical world's understanding of this as a serious condition worthy of attention, diagnosis, and on-going care.
No wonder we resort to tie-dyed bandage installations!
Lots to be done! Onward!
Binney -
New idea for wrap 'art' -- Everyone send their worn out bandages to one person (I nominate Hugz), who can make the LE bandage-equivalent of a giant rubber band ball. Huge. Enormous! Submit to Guiness Book of World Records. No one else will compete...guaranteed win and some media attention to what the heck LE bandages are in the first place! And we can challenge some PTs (those that believe added LE training is not needed) to unravel the ball and demonstrate arm-wrapping skill in public.
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Carol, I love the Giant Guiness wrap ball! Seriously what a good idea in real life. If I just had the time I would volunteer to get the ball going, then my dream would be to take it to the Breast Cancer walk(thousands attend) in October and set up a booth for an attention getter.I would have some girls wearing wraps and compression stuff. My signage at the booth would be "If you have had even one lymph node out due to Cancer surgery, you could have Lymphedema" And another sign that gives early symptoms that doctors may not recognize. And finally symptoms of full blown LE. Of course I would have loud speaker and phamplets to educate, educate, educate. And maybe a DVD on LE to boot! What a good idea. I would want my wrap ball to be so big that I would have to put it on a flat deck trailer!
Am practicing my hand wraping still. I don't want to do it tonight but Tina has encouraged me so I can't let her down.
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I always wanted to be in Guiness but I never thought it might be due to LE. Hope you wrapped last night Hugz. And hope you see a difference this morning.
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I think the rash on my arm is down enough that I am going to wrap tonight, Hugz. I have to - I already ate my chocolate reward. :-/ If I can wrap correctly within 1 1/2 hrs, I will let myself have two more squares. Tonight I am using all fresh materials, as I still need to wash the other set of bandages. I can only do so much laundry in one day!!!
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Becky, I did spent about hour just wrapping my hand, Once I get this down pat then I will move to foam phase and practice that. I don't need to wear it, I am just being a good little girl and adding it to my tool kit.
Tina, I'll support you by wrapping tonight. I will be doing it about 10 oclock as I need to have quiet when I do it. Kids, husbands, just interrupt me and I get mixed up. I see you are a little premature with your chocolate reward. Oh, I do hope you get 2 more squares of chocolate for your reward.
Tina, I am glad your rash is improving. Did you decide what brand of soap to use on LE gear? To get my regular laundry to dry faster, I throw a DRY handtowel in the dryer with my wet stuff. Try that with your foam chip stuff. I bet it will dry really quick compared to just by itself.
Keep on wrapping all you girls.
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Carol, OK to the new art project, The giant Guiness bandage ball. I vote we have to wrap all the PT's inside the ball, then they have to unwrap it themselves. Of course the wraps would be sweaty dirty. I want the same smell as my neighbours boy's hockey gear that airs out and I can smell it 30ft away! Any more ideas? Where would we install the art project?
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Ok speaking of CHOCOLATE, there's a new study:
'Scientists now report clinical evidence that dark chocolate or raw cocoa powder rich in flavanols may enhance memory in healthy middle-aged people. In short, the results of a small clinical study showed that people who consumed flavanol-rich cocoa or chocolate routinely remembered things with less effort.'
A team led by Professor Andrew Scholey recruited 63 volunteers between the ages of 40 and 65 for their randomized, controlled, double-blind trial (Camfield DA et al. 2012). The participants were divided into three groups, each of which consumed a chocolate beverage daily for 30 days. Critically, each group's beverage contained 10 grams (1/3 oz) of chocolate, but each beverage delivered a different dose of cocoa flavanols:
- Group 1 - Dark, high-flavanol chocolate (500mg of cocoa flavanols)
- Group 2 - Dark, medium-flavanol chocolate (250mg of cocoa flavanols)
- Group 3 (control) - Dark, low-flavanol chocolate (almost no cocoa flavanols)
The amount of flavanols in the beverage consumed by Group 2 approximated the amount in 10 grams (1/3 oz) of a chocolate bar containing 40 to 50 percent cocoa solids. To minimize dietary influences on the results, the volunteers were not allowed to consume flavonoid-rich fruits, products containing caffeine, or an excess of alcohol. On the first and on the 30th day computer-tomography (CT) brain scans of the test subjects were made while participants solved tasks requiring "spatial working memory" ... the ability to remember where objects appeared. The speed and accuracy of the responses to a spatial working memory task were about the same in all three groups. However, compared with those in the control group, the CT scans showed less stress in the brains of the high- and medium-flavanol group. This means that the high- and medium-flavanol chocolate beverage lowered stress levels in the brain and allowed the test subjects to achieve the same performance with fewer brain resources. As the researchers put it, "Cocoa flavanol consumption may increase neural [brain] efficiency in spatial working memory function" (Camfield DA et al. 2012).
So: Less stress in the brain + memory enhancer = perfect food for an LE diet. Goodness knows we have too much stress, and for sure memory is needed to learn how to wrap (or just to remember to drink water!)
(Never mind that this study was funded by Callebaut, the chocolate maker...I plan to forget that little item!)
Carol
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Hugz, I think you said you're in the Pacific NW. Isn't there a space needle in Seattle? We could stab the Guiness Bandage Ball on the top of the needle. That would make quite an eye-catcher, no? And when the PTs unwrap it, it can be a kind of maypole dance. Lebed rhythms, of course.
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Carol, one of my ideas for the Olymphics' opening ceremony was going to be a Maypole dance using bandages! I thought of that when you were wondering about a symbolic art project. Aw, I don't want to wrap my LE therapist, she is wonderful! Now, let's go back to the docs in denial! They have to learn how to wrap and need to practice on each other until they master!!
Okay, honesty time. I ate two more pieces of chocolate and still haven't wrapped. I rarely have chocolate cravings, and when I do I give in to them. Still doing loads of laundry, but I can see the end. Hoping after next load goes in wash that I can wrap and then use left hand to transfer final load to dryer. I just want this over!! I found three more tops in my drawer that needed to be washed. They will have to wait until next regular round. -
Gee, Tina, you really are washing everything you own! That's a huge project.
I think the original silly suggestion on including PTs in the Guiness bandage ball pertained to the PT organizations that are campaigning to allow PTs to practice LE therapy without any additional LE training. The wonderful therapists who have taken the time to seek the needed training are surely not candidates for our cynical fun-poking!
You deserve lots of chocolate, just for doing all that laundry to remove the allergens!
Carol -
Ooh, I forgot about those nasty lobbying PTs. We'll make them practice wrapping with the docs in denial. Yes, I am doing almost all of my laundry, as it's just as easy to do most everything than trying to figure out what was or wasn't washed since the new detergent was purchased. Fortunately, it's easy to launder stuff and mostly casual wear. Just time consuming. I'm glad you agree I deserve chocolate! Saving last load for tomorrow and stopping after done folding. Current load in dryer can stay there and get fluffed in the morning. I am nodding out and climbing in bed NOW.
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Carol, Oh my yes, The space needle just needs that wrap art stuck on the end of the needle, Your funny, what a hoot! I'll drive it down and hopefully all the rain on the coast here will not make it too heavy to hoist up. Yes, the maypole dance with doctor's in denial to Abba's "Dancing Queen" off the Lebed dvd!
Tina, I have nudged you on the LE butt kick thread to wrap. Come on let's bite the bullet and do it.Then you can cave in and Carol has confirmed it that you may enjoy more chocolate. Since chemo dried my hormones up and blew out the window Chocolate is my new passion!
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I'm caving, Hugz, although my arm probably would have appreciated after all the laundry. Promise to do it tomorrow. You have my word.
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Tina, Ok, I just practiced the gaused hand and braved the foam part too. If I just set aside my life and say I need to wrap and get in the zone, it works better for me. I just succumb. Your arm probably needed the wrap but I get it. Sometimes we just can't face the LE upkeep. Go on with what is left with the evening and we will start fresh tomorrow.
Girls,My therapist has me using one long roll of foam. She didn't make me a hand piece she just cut a hole in the long foam for my thumb to go thru. I think this makes it hard for me to get the foam posistioned in the right place on the palm and the foam wrinkles as I go down towards the wrist. It doesn't lay straight because the wrist is skinnier than the hand. Any ideas on laying the foam so it doesn't wrinkle when I use it in one long piece? Are wrinkles ok in the foam? Have I confused you yet? I
I see some people have a H shape hand piece of foam that is seperate from the long arm foam piece. Is that easier to have 2 seperate pieces, one for the hand and one for the arm?
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Hugz4u, I also have a thumb hole in the long piece of foam. It does wrinkle a bit, but less if I start by my hand and go up.
I really better start practising wrapping again since I haven't been, and summer is starting. Summer here is HOT HOT HOT. Well, yeah, it's the Middle East.
Chocolate and water for everyone!
Leah
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If I knew chocolate would be at the end of wrapping it certainly would go faster!
Carol-Thanks for clarifying which PTs would be unwrapping our project. Mine is wonderful and amazing and I would not sacrifice her. Mine now that is. The four I had before you can have. Problem is they wrapped okay, it was just the rest was ignored.
I love the way chocolate research is going! When will they categorize it as a vegetable? Then it will be 0 points in weight watcher's points!!!!
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I can not tell you how much I enjoy the visual of the giant wrapped ball stuck on the needle!!
You wrappers are all amazing!! My hats off to you all.
Chocolate is always deserved. Tina, you defnitely deserved those extra pieces.
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In the spirit of full disclosure, I'm not wrapping because the compression sleeve and MLD do the job for me. I am in AWE of hugz' commitment to learning in advance of need. So I'm poking around in here to learn a bit about wrapping, and of course to offer moral support if I can.
Maybe we should change the saying 'hat's off'' and say 'wrap's off to you!"
Instead of 'a tip of the hat' it's 'a flip of the wrap' for a job well done.
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Hugz and Tina--Binney recommends we wrap about once a month to not lose our touch. So instead of my jovipak tonight I will wrap. I will time myself. I am sure it will be slower than it used to be as I have not done so for several months. I did get it down to about 10-12 minutes. We'll see. I just pulled all of the wrapping materials out. Can't believe I used to do it nightly for awhile!
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