Alternative Treatment

susieq58:   We are all equal sisters on BCO and should be treated as such.  Nobody should be attacked.  This is a site where people come for comfort and support.  Everyone should do their part to try and keep it that way.  If someone steps out of line it's better to ignore than to respond so that the thread doesn't lose momentum.  

I'm sorry if my post last night (this morning in the USA) alarmed anyone.  I was very tired and dreading the 90 minutes I will soon spend in the dentists chair. I didn't like being told I was patronising as many people interpret my rather factual and long winded way of talking that way.  I guess I'll need a brain transplant to fix that, LOL. I've had a lifetime of being teased, ridiculed and excluded because I'm different so I'm probably over sensitive about that. 

I've had the most amazing amount of support from this thread and in PM's from people who think my view is very informed and balanced, and I know I accept everyone's views even though it scares the heck out of me when anyone refuses surgery as I've seen reports of the horrendous result that can happen when the tumour breaks through the skin. The smell is so bad that the patient sometimes can't keep food down and their loved ones gag and run out of the room. And that doesn't address the overwhelming pain and psychological issues these women have to deal with. Sorry to be so graphic but those refusing surgery should be give the chance to avoid such a situation.  I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy.

Chemo for ILC is still recommended as they just haven't had the many studies and reviews long enough to accept them yet.  Eventually people will look back on this thread and realise we are ahead of our time when chemo is no longer the standard treatment for ILC. I don't see it as controversial but am certainly sad for any women who go through a bad time of suffer long term consequences when the hormonals may have been good enough on their own.  For those who believe chemo saved their life, good for you!

I must brush my teeth now and face the dentists chair.  Have a nice sleep everyone. 

Is the idea really that chemo may not be discussed here as a viable treatment? If so, I was not aware and my apologies.

The studies regarding chemo and ILC are certainly interesting, but on the other hand, those of us who had neo-adjuvant chemo with ILC know that it does kill cancer cells. I will be sure to ask my onc though next time I see him.

This whole discussion also reminds me of the discussion I had with my doc about zometa. I had read that zometa+AI had been shown effective. He then outlined for me the study that was based on, explained the method of that study and who was stidued. He then outlined two subsequent studies done to replicate the results of the first study. The subsequent studies had failed to do so. But, he said, if you crunched the subgroups of the second study, you could still conclude that there might be a benefit for women like me, given my specifics.

My point being that it is not always as simple as it appears. 

The dental treatment was horrid.  The molds are like play dough but with a vile taste, and sit so far back that the gag reflex starts and you can't speak.  Bits of it got stuck to my face and the roof of my mouth too.  AAAAHHH thank goodness that's over.

I love all you ladies even when you're fighting as I know you're just passionate about wanting to stop your BC sisters from making any errors that might mean progression and all that goes with it.  I've been so glad I came back after the break I had, as the ideas, information and research are like my lifeblood.  I find out new things every day and I'm excited about the new vaccines and studies about sugar, Metformin, aspirin, glycolysis and finding out how to starve cancer rather than poison it.

Thanks and big hugs to all who tried to help in any way. I don't know where I'd be without you all. 

I think all these assumptions about cancer cells floating around after surgery will be sorted out when and if researchers use the more sensitive CTC tests to see just what is happening in the blood before and after surgery.  Then they need to find out if there are cells hiding away somewhere, probably in the bone marrow, possibly in other places too. 

Or they could combine chemo with a drug to clear all cancer stem cells (CSC's), though I don't know if they can reach CSC's in the marrow.

• Metformin Selectively Targets Cancer Stem Cells, and Acts Together with Chemotherapy to Block Tumor Growth and Prolong Remission

Abstract
The cancer stem cell hypothesis suggests that, unlike most cancer cells within a tumor, cancer stem cells resist chemotherapeutic drugs and can regenerate the various cell types in the tumor, thereby causing relapse of the disease. Thus, drugs that selectively target cancer stem cells offer great promise for cancer treatment, particularly in combination with chemotherapy. Here, we show that low doses of metformin, a standard drug for diabetes, inhibits cellular transformation and selectively kills cancer stem cells in four genetically different types of breast cancer. The combination of metformin and a well-defined chemotherapeutic agent, doxorubicin, kills both cancer stem cells and non-stem cancer cells in culture. Furthermore, this combinatorial therapy reduces tumor mass and prevents relapse much more effectively than either drug alone in a xenograft mouse model. Mice seem to remain tumor-free for at least 2 months after combinatorial therapy with metformin and doxorubicin is ended. These results provide further evidence supporting the cancer stem cell hypothesis, and they provide a rationale and experimental basis for using the combination of metformin and chemotherapeutic drugs to improve treatment of patients with breast (and possibly other) cancers. [Cancer Res 2009;69(19):7507-11]

If the cure comes along then none of this matters and we all win, except our dear sisters who have already departed.

Momine - I will Wisconsin your big toe only if you mess with me.  Why does that make me think of toe cheese??  ;-)

I'm loving the metformin trials, too.  There's more and more evidence supporting an inflammation-cancer link, and if high glucose levels cause inflammation, then it's logical that metformin would help.  

I have a theory on the aromatase inhibitors - it's not the AI that works, but all of the anti-inflammatories we take to fight the AI-caused pain! 

The Wisconsin reference seems to be a USA in-joke.  Is it to do with football?

I don't know about the AI's, but Tamoxifen is an antioxidant!

Cr-p!  Scoot... That's really tough.  I have my suspicions about ER+/PR-, that it's a different animal from double positive. I guess Tamox failed well before the diagnosis as it would take time to get to that stage. 

I wonder if they'll let us rest from Tamox to take the new drug that makes Tamox work again? Maybe after 2 to 3 years on it.

American history.  I know little about it as any history bores me.  I have to keep looking up the map to see where the different States are, then I go to Google street view to look around, now that's interesting.  I'm getting to know a bit of geography.  At least I know what you mean now.

There's more and more evidence supporting an inflammation-cancer link,

....yes, and in fact inflammation could also be a cause of spread. Some theorize that it could cause a dormant genetic mutation to become active. Something of this is mentioned in the book "The Emperor of all Maladies"

Scoot, as long as you stay with toe cheese ...

Please don't tell me that about AIs, since I started femara 2 days ago.  

Sandy, gee thanks! Killer AIs??? What was that all about, if you don't mind letting me know?

Hmmmm....not a new member?

Edited for....never mind. :-)

zuvart (daisy) -

Regarding your "how many times do you need to be reminded" question, I would guess the answer is at least once more.

Just a guess.  

By the way, the discussion is linked to the sugar/inflammation discussion on the last few pages, so it is related. 

Momine - I sent you a PM regarding AIs.

And now, back to your regularly scheduled alternative treatment only for God's sake program.

Scoot 

I don't know how others feel about the topic, but let's say baking soda actually worked as a viable treatment....somehow I have my doubts it would be used. JMO, but if there's no money in it, it won't be developed as a treatment. Heaven forbid the pharmaceutical/supplement industry doesn't get their jagnormous share for shoving something into a capsule or IV bag.

PatMom, that's what I think. If it worked, someone would have to screw with it, patent it, charge a fortune, or you'd have to go through some black-market, hoop-jumping to get it and end up paying hundreds of dollars for a $1.00 supply of baking soda.