Doctor tells FDA .... mammogram won't spot cancer....

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http://medicalxpress.com/news/2011-11-doctor-fda-mammogram-wont-cancer.html

Doctor tells FDA to change rules; says mammogram won't spot cancer in some

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  • PLJ
    PLJ Member Posts: 373
    edited November 2011

    It irks me when they mention the concern for false-positives and unnecessary biopsies due to MRI. Having gone misdiagnosed for 1 year due to docotor stupidity and no access to MRI, I would rather 50 false-positives than the false-negative that I had. Just my 2 cents.

  • geewhiz
    geewhiz Member Posts: 1,439
    edited November 2011

    The very day they changed the rules originally to no mammos for anyone under 50, I was ironically sitting in my first chemo infusion chair scared out of my mind...watching a cnn news crew film a segment on it at my research hospital. I had just turned 42 at diagnosis, thin, athletic, clean living and no family history. That mammogram at age 41 saved my life. I want to whack this doc over the head with something...maybe a basket full of foobs.

  • crazy4carrots
    crazy4carrots Member Posts: 5,324
    edited November 2011
    geewhiz -- As I read it, this radiologist was saying that a mammogram that shows dense breasts should be a signal to do further testing, in order to rule out a cancer that can't be detected on a mammo.
    Why would you argue with that?  You were fortunate that a mammo showed your cancer.  In too many younger women with dense breasts, a mammo alone is useless because the tumour is too difficult to distinguish.
  • Suze35
    Suze35 Member Posts: 1,045
    edited November 2011

    I don't know if an MRI would have saved me from a Stage IV diagnosis down the road, but it sure as hell would have caught my tumors 5 months earlier than I did.  The letter I got in the mail from my clear mammo in April 2010 - "all is fine."  What was on the actual report?  "Very dense breasts that make mammograms a poor diagnostic tool for this patient.  Emphasis should be made to the patient to perform SBEs."  (Paraphrased.)  I then discovered two 4 cm tumors in September 2010 with 4 obvious nodes.  I was 41 years old.

    I actually wrote a letter to the radiation department about the discrepancy in what was on the report and what I was told.  Not blaming them, just pointing out that they did not give me vital information.  Not surprisingly, I never heard back from them.

  • otter
    otter Member Posts: 6,099
    edited November 2011

    lindasa, IMHO, your reading is correct... but some radiologists disagree.  This, which I copied from the article, is the sort of thing that really irks me.  It's the official position of the "American College of Radiology" (ACR) which is the main professional credentialling organization to which radiologists belong:

    +++++quote begins+++++++

    "The American College of Radiology, in a position statement, said that it recognizes that greater breast density leads to lower sensitivity for mammography. While information on breast density is helpful for physicians, it said, 'It is less clear how the typical patient would interpret or understand the same information.' "

    "Patients with dense breasts might demand additional alternative forms of screening, such as ultrasounds or MRIs, which would lead to more false positives and unnecessary breast biopsies.

    "If the alternate forms of screening were not covered by insurance, that might lead to 'an unfortunate disparity' between those who could pay for it themselves and those who couldn't. And women without dense breasts might develop a false sense of security, the policy statement said."

    +++++quote ends++++++

    Okay, so let me see if I have this straight...  The ACR doesn't want radiologists to inform women that they have dense breast tissue, because it isn't known how those women would "interpret or understand" that information.  So, they think we're too frickin' stupid to be able to figure out what it means, or whether it's significant.  And, apparently, they aren't willing to explain it to us.  Isn't that sort of like a doctor declining to tell a patient she has high cholesterol, because it isn't clear how she will "interpret or understand" that information?

    And, if we do happen to find out that our breast tissue is dense, we might "demand additional screening" (duh!).  What if people with high blood glucose were not told about it, for fear they might "demand additional screening" to see if they were diabetic?  Egads!  Can you imagine the chaos!

    And, naturally, all that "additional screening" those hysterical women would demand, "would lead to false positives and unnecessary breast biopsies"...  which, of course, seems to be the medical profession's greatest concern.  They're not worried about false-negative results, overlooking a suspicious area, or failing to detect a malignancy.  They think it's more important to avoid false-positives and "unnecessary" diagnostic procedures.  I guess they never met a negligence suit they didn't like?  (That does explain why the ACR doesn't want to change official policy.  Malpractice lawsuits are based on failure to follow "standard of care.")

    But, I think it's the last paragraph of that quote that sends me over the edge:  the ACR's concern about "unfortunate disparity" and a "false sense of security." 

    Okay, let's assume that some insurance companies will cover the "additional screening", and others will not.  Faced with denial of coverage, some patients will have the resources to pay for the screening out-of-pocket; while others will not.  But, to avoid "an unfortunate disparity" between the insured and the un/under-insured, or between those who can pay out-of-pocket and those who cannot, the ACR would withhold information about breast density from all women having mammograms.  My mind is flooded with absurd analogies.

    And, finally, gosh... suppose some women who are told their breast tissue is not dense become complacent, and "develop a false sense of security."   We wouldn't want to give them any false assurance that their risk of cancer might be lower than anyone else's, would we?  You know, sort of like sending a woman a form letter, telling her that her most recent mammogram showed "no evidence of cancer"?

    [Excuse me while I go in the other room and barf.]

    We need radiologists to get onboard with this breast-density thing -- to agree that, for women with dense breasts, policies need to change, and to agree on a protocol for reporting mammographic density.  (There is no consensus protocol right now.)  At the very least, women with dense breasts should be informed of the condition, so we're aware of it.  To deny us this critical information about our bodies is like not telling someone she has high blood pressure, because she might not know how to interpret the information and it might cause her undue anxiety.  Sheesh.

    [Sorry this is so long... longer than usual, even.  Must have hit a nerve.]

    otter

  • cp418
    cp418 Member Posts: 7,079
    edited November 2011

    Otter ---- LOVE Your POST!!!  I wish I could write half as well as you do!!  Thank you for taking the time to put into words exactly how I feel.  You also accurately summarized my recent battles with my Drs for additional screening to yearly mammogram. 

    A bit off topic but I recently heard about this new US scanning modality available.  I was very interested to pursue and find out more information as it is now available at the hospital where I was treated. I was told it requires a Drs script but is not covered by insurance and costs around $300.  That some how did not make sense if you do NOT have to go through an insurance provider for approval like MRI.  Direct patient payment only and no reimbursement from insurance.  So I contacted the company and they are inquiring back to the hospital that women should not require a Dr script.  Patients should be allowed to schedule a scan appt if they would like an additional methodolgy to back up their yearly mammogram.  I am definitely going to pursue this in the future considering all the denials I've gotten for MRI or US on alternating years to monitor me. I kept being told only allowed if I was BRCA positive.  (Moderate Dense breasts and Gail score 35)

    http://sonocine.com/

  • Suze35
    Suze35 Member Posts: 1,045
    edited November 2011

    Otter, thank you for that breakdown.  Now I know WHY I wasn't told the full details, and I agree, it makes me want to vomit.  Would I have asked for more testing?  Oh yes, most definitely.  And yes, I would have been in that group that could afford to pay it out of pocket, creating an "unfortunate disparity."  I guess taking care of my health is no longer my right.  I truly feel sick.

    Wugh.

  • mdg
    mdg Member Posts: 3,571
    edited November 2011

    If I knew I had dense breasts before maybe my tumor would have been spotted on an MRI a year earlier and it may have only been DCIS. They keep pushing mammos and awareness but mammos give a false sense of security. My mammo missed my tumor. It is not right that they don't do ultrasounds.

  • cp418
    cp418 Member Posts: 7,079
    edited November 2011

    Some patients could avoid Chemo if caught before spreading to the nodes.  When I was dx 2006 with 1 positive sentinel node it was automatic chemo treatments 4 DD AC, 4 DD Taxol.  Oncotype was not yet allowed for testing with 1 positive node.  Chemo was hell to put it mildly.....  If I had an US maybe my chemo treatments could have been avoided before it got to the nodes.

  • PLJ
    PLJ Member Posts: 373
    edited February 2012
  • Boo307
    Boo307 Member Posts: 222
    edited November 2011

    This just confirms the need for patients to request copies of the radiologist's report as well as the doctor's notes of each visit.  It has been fascinating what I learned from reading those reports, such as that I have dense breasts!

    The guidelines and most discussion is about 'which tests and how often to shedule it' .  That is about finding cancers in a large populaiton of women.  My only concern is finding any cancer in my body.  Public health officials worry about the former.  Our job is the look out for ourselves.

    My surgeon recommended two mammagrams a year, so I asked for an MRI and mammogram, which is what I am doing.  When I had a biopsy for what turned out to be necrotic fat tissue the radiologist encouraged me to stick with an MRI and mammogram progaram.  She suggested even when I go to once a year to have a mammo one year and an MRI the next. 

    Boo 

  • Peaches70
    Peaches70 Member Posts: 210
    edited March 2012

    I just posted under another board about breast density. I just paid that $300 for the ultrasound (Sonocine) and it did turn up 2 areas of concern that were totally NOT on the mammogram. They may turn out to be cysts, but if they don't...I am going after the insurance about reimbursement. If they are negative, great. I will have more peace of mind - but not a "false sense of security". I'll just be happy that these 2 areas (which were on my MRI 2 years ago) were finally checked out.

  • cp418
    cp418 Member Posts: 7,079
    edited March 2012

    I am scheduled for the Sonocine US next month along with my yearly mammogram.  I had to give up fighting with my BS and previous Oncologist over moderate dense breasts to get a MRI or US. They could not be bothered to followup with insurance  - - would only do if mammogram showed or if I was BRCA +. (I'm neg)  I've since changed Oncologist and new PCP who had no issue writing me the Sonocine script.  Now just to get through the stress of waiting for this appt to be over and praying all will be clear. April is the month I was dx and brings back bad memories.

  • Peaches70
    Peaches70 Member Posts: 210
    edited March 2012

    Good luck, cp418. April is the month I had my first biopsy in 2006 (ALH), so it brings up memories for me as well. My oncologist is also the one who wrote me a script for the Sonocine. I love my breast surgeon, but I was disappointed when she did not insist on finding an alternative screening method once MRI was no longer an option for me. I do not understand why/how insurance gets away with denying payment for this. It IS ultrasound, just enhanced with a special armature and computer programming. The story I got was that there is no code for it, therefore no coverage. But there is a code for ultrasound - so why not use that code?

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