Sometimes alternative treatments don't do it

Hi Icandothis,

It is very sad to see someone have recurrence after a long break of good health, and hard to lose out to the disease, whatever treatment one chooses to use.

I have a personal memory of a young friend with breast cancer. She was a lovely young woman, a nurse, with a young husband, full of life. She did conventional treatment, going through all the trauma of being ill and bald and weak and tired, and got no benefit at all from it, sadly.

What made it worse was that treatment took away what chance that young couple had to enjoy youthful intimacy in the time that she had left before she died. When she could no longer see well enough to read her favorite passages, I sent her audio tapes. She wrote me, saying that she appreciated very much that I spoke openly about the good and bad of treatments, and said that all the cheerleading for treatments that do often fail people is unfortunate. She chose hospice and found it very meaningful.

AlaskaAngel

Thank you so much for posting this.  I have always felt those who turn away from standard treatment in the face of serious illness need counseling at the time of diagnosis.  It's some kind of god complex, or "I know better", or "I'm different and have the secret"--I don't understand it, because it's not my style and I was young and knew I couldn't find "the answer" before some darned serious choices had to be made.  The statistics are so clear:  if you have late-stage cancer, you NEED allopathic treatment to try and get through. Of course it doesn't work for everyone.  But I've watched women walk away from standard treatment again and again, and for sure, none of them have been saved in my experience.

What was absolutely crushing for me was watching women in my age bracket with Stage III+ cancer walk away from allopathic treatments.  What was even sadder was my radiation oncologist who told me not to bother (I offered to speak to one).  He said he spent too many nights crying, too many days trying to convince them...and it never worked.

Yes, a sad story indeed.  There are thousands of stories like this from both conventional and alternative therapies.  My friend with lung cancer who got rads and chemo up until one week before she died was given the same hope....the tumors are gone...you have no more cancer in your body.  Of course, by then she was so ill and malnourished that she couldn't recover.  She literally starved to death.  

I don't have the answer...as individuals we have to decide that an alternative treatment is something that we want to pursue and then do our research and decide on our own if it is right for us.  I think the same is true of conventional treatments.  I would never let a doctor decide for me what type of treatment I should have without doing my own research.  It's just the way I am. 

What we need are more drugs like Herceptin that do the job without the debiliting SE's.  Why isn't more research being put into developing those drugs instead of continuing to rely on the poison and burn techniques that have been in place for the last 50 years?  I just saw the movie "Living Proof" about the doctor who developed Herceptin and the difficult time he had getting funding to continue his research and then getting it to clinical trials.  It would seem that he was treated like the enemy rather than someone who was on the brink of finding a breakthrough drug that could save lives!  Why does this happen?  I don't want to believe it's ego and greed, but unfortunately what other choice is there? 

AnneW, I think that house fire is a good analogy.  The bigger the fire, the bigger the arsenal you will need.  I think CAM/alt treatments can add a lot to conventional treatment - for instance, acupuncture has been scientifically proven to reduce and alleviate chemo-induced neuropathy.  Some supplements have also been found to make a big difference, like B1, B6, and Acetyl-L-Carnitine (currently in trial).  Since many people end up delaying or eliminating infusions due to neuropathy, it makes sense that these alt treatments are a great option.  Your QOL is better and you are better able to keep up with treatment,  which can improve your overall prognosis.  Plus, you don't have to spend time after chemo waiting for the neuropathy to resolve.  Win - win, as far as I am concerned.

As for post-conv-treatment, I think about my CAM/alt treatments the same way I think  about a seat belt.  Might not prevent death or injury, but it can certainly help.  

I posted on another thread that my supplements that I am taking helped to keep my recent flu bug from getting worse, and I was able to eliminate it in less than three days when normally it might take 7-10 days.  I was politely told and reminded that those who are on chemo are not to take supplements because it could interfear with their treatment.  I would never challenge that statement on that particular thread, but I do have a question that I will put forth here.

I just read a book by Dr. Christine Horner that indicated that supplementation is complementary to chemo and helps the treatment work better, so which is it?  Where are the studies that prove that supplements are bad to take with chemo, or is it just an opinion of the conv medical community that don't believe supplements work.   

I suppose it would depend on the supplement. For instance, something benign as grapefruit has adverse interactions with a number of drugs. Having said that, I think it's just an opinion of the conv medical community for the most part.

ICanDoThis, I am so very sorry to read about your friend. I don't know what her treatments were the first time around, but maybe, for her, she did go on her own terms. We can never really get inside the head of someone who's suffering. Ultimately, it's a personal decision....how far we want to go....how hard we want to fight....and in what way. Cancer is a b*tch

It definitely depends on the supplement. Grapefruit is out for many drugs, as is St. John's wort.  But the blanket "no-supplements-on-chemo" isn't true.

AnneW- Very well put.

Yorkiemom,

I know a few who did surgery + alt and are here 5+ years later.  They did several alt treatments though - not just diet.  It's expensive and time consuming and I think it is more successful with lower stage, less aggressive cancers.  But I know people who did it.  That being said, they were all early stage, less aggressive cancers.  I couldn't find ladies with my diagnosis that had successfully pursued alt treatments, so I did the full course of everything that the doctors had, plus all my CAM stuff.    Here's hoping we all beat this!

For the record, I also know Stage IV women that either got more time or actually are experiencing regression through adding alt treatments.  Coincidence?  I kind of doubt it.  Once is a miracle, twice is a coincidence, three times is a pattern.  So I believe that the right alt treatments can and do make a difference.  However, I generally prefer an integrative approach from doctors who are up on the latest in both conv and alt fields.

Altho I did rads I cannot/will not take any of the ALs.Yes I did try 1 but i have many stomach issues and thes pill i refuse to take...now remember im 71 yrs ol.I have a great QOL except when my stomach acts up or my back...

I would get a 2% chance of over a 5 yr.period.No thank you..

My problem is i cannot take either the DIM or the 13C( works like the ALs) I cannot eat veggies either.

I did make huge changes in my diet,lifestyle including exercises daily,walking and dancing.I live on Ensure and Peanut butter.once in a while i do eat fish and chicken

Ill take my chances only because of my AGE.I do pray alot!!!

huggggs everyone.K

Alternative treatment is not just sitting around doing some wishful thinking.  It is not the same as sticking your head in the sand and pretending that nothing is wrong.  It is about finding the best treatment for your situation, and being willing to make adjustments in that treatment if they are warranted.

We know that exercise is helpful in dealing with breast cancer, but if exercise alone cured or prevented breast cancer, then this board would not be nearly so large, and would not have so many angels.  That is the way it is with most breast cancer treatment, whether conventional or alternative.  It may be helpful, but as of today, there is no cure, and there are no guarantees.

It is very sad that your friend's aunt died, and that her health care provider seems to have failed her by lying to her about her situation. 

Is it possible that she was fully aware that her second go round with cancer was metastatic from the beginning?  That being 9 years older than when she was originally diagnosed, she was not willing to spend what limited time she had left doing the slash, poison and burn treatments that conventional medicine had to offer her?  We know that too many women here do intense conventional treatments and still are gone far too soon, some less than a year after diagnosis. 

There are plenty of people who had surgery only, and are alive and well more than a decade after diagnosis.  There have been studies recently that some early stage cancers can resolve themselves, even untreated. 

If someone does "only alternative" with no surgery, there is no way to know for sure that they have cancer, so if their alternative treatment works, or if their tumor is one of the self-resolving ones, they may not know for sure that they ever had cancer, so how would anyone know that they are 10 year+ survivors? 

ICanDoThis, I'm so sorry to hear your story. When I was going through Tx a couple people mentioned alt treatments that sounded like pure quackery. (one example: a  special balm that supposedly makes your tumor come out through the skin) Personally, I'm hoping we see some big scientific breakthroughs in the next couple decades due to advances in our understanding of genetics. I'm hoping that rads and chemo will become obsolete in my lifetime, replaced by smarter, more targeted treatment. (and better understanding so we can prevent this dang disease in the first place)

Essa, thanks. You said what I wanted to say in gentle terms I invite anyone, in all sincerity, to visit us on the stage IV forum, learn from us about standard protocol. There is a woman there at the moment desperate for help in regard to her mother, who has similar, serious end stage symptoms, though hers involve bleeding. Her doctors have said there is nothing they can do.  Im sorry for your friend's aunt, but maybe she was stage IV with recurrence?, and made her choices, which are very personal, and sometimes hard to understand if not in that position. I do believe she had a right to pain relief and hospice if she wanted that, and she, like all of us at stage IV, could have organised an advanced care directive to that effect.

But, the OP is a testamonial, though a heart felt one, and information is scetchy. It would be more helpful if the practitioner could be named and identified (as he/she should be), as well as the treatment. That type of warning could benefit people.