Which Is The Better ?

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NYruralrider
NYruralrider Member Posts: 41
edited June 2014 in Triple-Negative Breast Cancer
Which Is The Better ?
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  • NYruralrider
    NYruralrider Member Posts: 41
    edited September 2011

    I was wondering is it better to have had an aggressive 5.7 cm DCIS tumor w/ 2 micro invasions, clean nodes VS. a 1 cm tumor, non aggressive, with mirco involvement w/ the senitinal node??

     I understand none of this is good...just wondering which would be worse.....

    Thanks,

    NYruralrider

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  • Luah
    Luah Member Posts: 1,541
    edited September 2011

    Not sure either gets the edge, NY. Why do you ask?

    The thing about TN is that nodal non-involvement is not a reliable prognosticator as it seems to be with ER + BC. Sadly, there are women on these boards that ended up with mets despite clean nodes at the beginning. It really is a crap shoot. But I would say DCIS is a good (relatively) thing compared with invasive.

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  • kyroheal
    kyroheal Member Posts: 48
    edited September 2011

    Hey luah,

    Wondering where you got that information from? Nodal involvement in TN vs ER? Thanks

    Sandy

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  • Suze35
    Suze35 Member Posts: 1,045
    edited September 2011

    Kyroheal - not Luah, but wanted to chime in. I've read a research paper that ultimately confirmed what Luah said - recurrence statistics are pretty much the same for Stage I through Stage IIIa. Nodal involvement is not nearly as good a prognostic factor as it is for ER+. I'll try and find the study that has that information.



    NY - I think the DCIS is still the more favorable diagnosis, but it is really apples to oranges. ER+ has better treatment options unfortunately. It really can't be compared.

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  • kyroheal
    kyroheal Member Posts: 48
    edited September 2011

    :(

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  • Suze35
    Suze35 Member Posts: 1,045
    edited September 2011
    You know, I've been looking for that study, and found one that said that nodal status does matter for TN.  So honestly, I just don't know.  Kyroheal, you are early stage, I think you have a really great  shot at staying cancer-free, and I feel badly for causing you stress.  Most TNs are very sensitive to chemo.  Hang in there ((hugs)). 
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  • Luah
    Luah Member Posts: 1,541
    edited September 2011

    kyroheal: I probably over-simplifed things and for that I apologize. I was speaking anecdotally, but I'll post more fully now!

    Two points to make: One is that in other BCs, tumour size and node positivity usually correlate; not so much in TN. Even small tumours can show positive nodes. This result is shown in a very informative paper on TN patterns and behaviours, but I post the link with a caveat. The research goes back 10 years with older chemo regimens so do NOT get hung up on the recurrence rates, they don't apply to our situation today; however the patterns that are seen in TN have been borne out by other more recent research... such as timing of recurrence, etc.: http://clincancerres.aacrjournals.org/content/13/15/4429.full#T1

    The other point I was trying to make is shown in this research: http://foodforbreastcancer.com/studies/6863  It concludes that "tumor size is a more important prognostic indicator than the number of positive lymph nodes among TN patients that are lymph node positive." Although I don't research much the other forms of BC, I think generally the more nodes that are positive, the bigger the tumour (usually) and the worse the prognosis. So we are different there: our prognosticator seems to be size (more than nodes) and # of nodes is not really related to size. I'm sure I've made that clear as mud.

    And all that said, I will go back to my earlier post that it's a crap shoot. For any one of us, the odds of recurrence are either 100% or nothing.    

    Lastly, I think we may have met up at Iris' house in August in Mississauga, the little TN group, am I right? Hope you're doing well.

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  • kyroheal
    kyroheal Member Posts: 48
    edited September 2011

    Hey luah,

    Thanks for posting! In the end, I feel there is no pattern to BC and it's really hard to predict anything. I do remember meeting you. It was a pleasure. I'll be done chemo in a month and I'm ready to move on. Hopefully we can have another get together soon :)

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  • NYruralrider
    NYruralrider Member Posts: 41
    edited September 2011

    This is shocking, I was encouraged my nodes were clean.....jeepers....I asked because I learned someone I know has the TN but had the 1st node slightly involved, tumor was smaller.....this is crazyCry  My onc did say had I waited another year this would have "nailed me"....there is some hope in him saying that. He also said I had a 95-96%of being OK. I hope this is not appeasement!

    NYruralrider

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  • Suze35
    Suze35 Member Posts: 1,045
    edited September 2011

    NY - you have to remember that so much of your tumor was DCIS, which by definition is not invasive. Please, please don't let this psych you out! You have an awesome chance at a really long life, I don't know statistics, but really, you are in great shape. When I was first diagnosed at Stage IIIa, my doctor gave me a 70-75% chance, and you are between Stage 0 and Ia.



    My suggestion - focus on doing the things you can do to help. Adjust your diet if need be, and get good exercise, both of which have shown a proven benefit for TN. Drink good quality green tea, take your Vitamin D, and please try to have a ton of hope. I would say the same to your friend. You both have a lot to be hopeful for.



    Hugs.

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  • NYruralrider
    NYruralrider Member Posts: 41
    edited September 2011

    Thank you Suze35Smile 

     I am taking my D. Last yr. I was low...this yr. I am not...onc recently had me double my dose.

    Can you suggest a good quality green tea? How do you know if it is good quality, what do I look for on the label? I do my work at the stable every day and ride when I can.

    I was shocked to see my friend at the cancer center. She did not know what type of TN she was but knew it started w/ an M.

    Thank you so much for your post! I really do get scared to look at this site, feel like I am opening Pandora's box,...but if I can learn anything to help it is worth it!

    Hugs backLaughing

    NYruralrider

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  • Luah
    Luah Member Posts: 1,541
    edited September 2011

    NYruralrider: Sorry if my post caused anxiety; the studies I posted were referring to (invasive) tumour size, not DCIS.  And even so, the actual survival rates can't be extrapolated for any one person. For one thing, the data goes back many years when treatments were not as effective. Please don't be fussed about all this...

    About green tea, on thing I've heard is that you should look for Japanese (sencha) varieties, not Chinese, for the most benefit. I'm sure some others on the boards are more expert on this though! Maybe try the nutrition threads... 

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  • Suze35
    Suze35 Member Posts: 1,045
    edited September 2011

    NY - I get green tea from Teavana, not exactly cheap, but I cen get 3-4 cups out of one teaspoon so it lasts forever. I'm pretty sure it is a Japanese variety, but you can definitely ask.



    Exercise is very good for us, along with a low fat diet. Sounds like you do great there!



    This board can be scary - boy, don't I know that! - be we are also really great at dispelling fears over old, not accurate data. Stick around and read when you are up for it. In 5 years, you will be the one supporting the newbies!

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