Hormonal Girls
This is an open invitation to all sisters stuck with the ER+\PR+, ER+\PR-, ER-/PR+ diagnoses. Let's wrap our heads around the problematic issue of phytoestrogens and bring to the table our findings, advice, cautions, secret tips, recipes, etc.
1) Herbs to weed out and herbs to adopt ?
2) Supplements - the good guys and the bad guys?
3) The good food vs the bad food (i.e to flax or not to flax) ?
4) The rubber ducks (xenoestrogens in bottled water, etc.) ?
From "What your Doctor May Not Tell You About Breast Cancer: How Hormone Balance Can Help Save Your Life" Dr. John Lee and Dr. Zava, PhD (biochemist, research scientist and internationally known speaker and leading expert in the field of hormone health) :
- For those ER+ Avoid Sunflower Seeds, Red Clover Tea, Camomille Tea, Alfalfa Sprouts, Queen Anne's lace (wild carrot), Pomegranate, Fennel, Licorice, Red Clover, Yucca, Hops (Beer) and Motherwort, Coffee and Decaffeinated Coffee,
- Avoid phytoestrogens that block and interfere with the action of Natural Progesterone: Bloodroot, Ocotillo, Mandrake, Oregano, Damiana, Pennyroyal, Verbenna, Nutmeg, Tumeric, Yucca, Thyme, Calamus, Red Clover, Goldenseal, Licorice, Mistletoe, Cumin, Fennel, Camomille, Cloves.
"Thank goodness for women's intuition that senses right from wrong"
Comments
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How come the ER+ girls have to avoid decaf? I miss my coffee, but I was hoping to have the occasional decaf!
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I wonder about soy...to soy or not to soy! I can never seem to figure this out.
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U know what Sweetbean, there,s no way i,m
giving up my cup of brew in am ! I never knew
coffee was estro
. There are herbs on that list though
that are very potent like licorice which can
elevate blood pressure (not the candy, but roots
and extracts) i just wanted people to beware
About soy i,m staying away from it, like the supplements
and tofu but i,m still using tamari sauce
i,m hoping the experts will join in the discussion -
great topic, Luan! i've never put full focus on the issue, but have wondered about it in the back of my mind. let's get to it:
i've gone back and forth on flaxseed. i thought the overall benefits outweigh risks?
didn't know about the pomegranate! i don't eat much of it, but it is touted as the "superfruit" (of course, the media is dismally wrong about most of cancer tx/research/ experience etc).
the most common idea: avoid alcohol. that is just fine with me, since i don't drink anymore.
janyce
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I have read a TON about phytoestrogens and all of the most recent research says that phytoestrogens are fine for us and are actually protective. I'm taking flaxseed every day. I eat soy as well, but in tofu form, rather than the "soy protein isolate" that is found in supplement bars. Since diagnosis, I cut sugar, processed food, white flour, caffeine, alcohol, red meat, and dairy out. It's a long list! And, to be honest, the only thing I miss is my morning iced coffee. I'm hoping to bring that one back as I feel more comfortable.
But cancer has been kinda traumatic, so it makes me feel better when I do something to protect myself, like eat right and exercise. -
Elmcity lets all dive in as if there weren,t enough issues we have to deal with!!
re flax i,ve never really used them. I figure there are so many other kinds of seeds out there. Dr Zava lists them as being even more estrogenic than soy. I guess one important factor to consider is what the numbers are, mine are 95% both ER and PR, so really got to look out
What i take from that list is that i,ve got to use more of the PR interfering stuff but stay away from those that are listed twice which would make them very potent.
I,m sure pomegranates are potent anti-ox but then also phyto-estrogenic.
Will have to do much more digging
I cringe at the fact that before dx i was self-medicating with the natural HRT with the genistein
and here i am .... -
The amount of estrogen in phytoestrogens is really small, though. It's not enough to feed the cancer, apparently. Not that I eat a ton of it, mind you, but I def don't think that the amount of estrogen in phytos is a concern. Xenoestrogens are what I am worried about...
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Sweetbean, what have u come up with re: bottled water?
Been drinking it for so many years - i always check the
date and won't buy anything past 3 months - apparently,
that's when the stuff starts leaking. i think i feel safe
with the BPA part, as i drink from PET 1 bottles but still concerned with the phthalates & co.
Cannot imagine not being able to drink my
4 L a day. THirst became my ennemy from chemo # 1.
If i want to get myself a nasty throat infection,
a few sips of tap water will do it -
Why can't you drink your 4 L a day Luan? Is it because of plastic bottles? Have you tried the stainless steel ones? That's what I've been using when I'm out and about or at the gym. We've also replaced all of our plastic tupperware with glass now. Xenoestrogens scare me more than eating vegetables, that's for sure. The list of phytoestrogens to avoid that my onc gave me states that when talking about fennel and pomegranate etc. it's not meaning food sources, it means more supplements/herbal remedies etc. So confusing, but I try not to go crazy over it. I LOVE pomegranates!
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Sherbear: I sure wish MY onco was so advanced, he really seems to be in a rut....I've looked at the thermos like water botlles, but they're too small. So, here I go, getting joint pains from lugging my 1.5 L around and looking silly
I tried to convince my single dad brother to thrash his microwave or to at least use glass containers as he is so concerned about his girls since my diagnosis, but I don't think I was successful...Now, I've got to work on him re sunscreen containing phytoestros. He just lathers on the stuff like there's no tomorrow. God, I mean, they're 9 & 11 and already budding breasts !!!!!
"The Center for Disease Control (CDC) released a new study showing that nearly all Americans are contaminated with oxybenzone, a widely-used sunscreen ingredient. This chemical so far has shown potential links to allergies, hormone disruption, and cell damage"
"Mother Nature's sunblock: Carotenoids are actually deposited into the skin to prevent sunburn and oxidative stress, i.e. whole eggs, spirulina, dark-green leafy vegetables (kale, collards, spinach, etc), and brightly colored yellow-orange fruits and vegetables (apricots, cantaloupe, sweet red peppers, carrots, sweet potatoes, yams, and squash).
The most potent carotenoid is a red pigment found in algae, salmon, trout, shrimp, lobsters, and other shellfish. It is known as astaxanthin. Astaxanthin is 1,000 times more effective at protecting skin from UV damage than other carotenoids. One way that you can provide a double whammy of skin protection is to take a daily Krill Oil supplement, as krill oil is a good source of astaxanthan as well as potent omega-3's in a form most usable by your body.Lycopene is found in red fruits such as tomatoes, red bell pepper and watermelon. Unlike many other fruits and vegetables, cooking actually increases this nutrient. Tomato paste actually has much more lycopene than fresh tomatoes. In one study, people who consumed tomato paste had 33% more protection against sunburn compared to a control group after 12 weeks.
Plenty of green tea a day for internal sun protection. Green tea is known to contain a category of antioxidants called polyphenols that boost the ability of skin to protect itself from the sun. If the idea of drinking warm green tea on a hot day is unappetizing, go for cool glass of iced green tea.
All teas are rich sources of various skin-protecting antioxidants, also yerba mate, rooibos, tulsi tea, mint, chamomile, and other teas... the more variety you use, the more diversity of antioxidants you obtain.Vitamin and flavanol-rich fruit like berries and other fruit such as mangoes, kiwis, peaches, cherries, and plums rich in vitamin C great for skin health. Known for its role in building collagen, vitamin C prevents wrinkles and photo damage through its anti-inflammatory action."
I'll try to find me Astaxanthin in a supplement form, have heard of it from other sources.
But then, we live in the "North" so our heavy exposure is kinda limited to 3 months a year.
Now, how did I get into sunscreens !!! Oh, yeah my precious nieces.....
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I have been reading foodforbreastcancer.com and using it as a guide for what I should eat/avoid. There are articles for each type of breast cancer etc. Here is the link for what to eat/avoid if you are ER+PR+
It is a difficult process. I am slowly changing to natural products and trying to limit sugar.
I am drinking the Brassica Green Tea recommended by John's Hopkins - 2 cups a day.
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Luan, check out Kleen Kanteen, it's one brand of stainless steel bottles and they come in all sizes. Mine is huge, lol.
Thanks for the info on sunscreen, I find it's such a tough call over the chemicals ones and the natural (ie white) ones. I've found a few I like, but none are perfect. I used to be big on wearing sunscreen everyday (face-wise), but I don't anymore as for me, I feel it's overkill and being up north, I want my natural Vit D as well. Of course, if I'm going to be outside for a period of time when I know I'll burn, I definitely wear it, but for incidental (which I know 'they' can sometimes say is the worst for wrinkles and cancer), I usually don't go there anymore.
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Valgirl: Wow, that looks great, thanks
Sherbear: Super, thanks ! I wonder if they would be heavier to carry if I were to get a bigger size ? I've had to downside my purse, as I get so much pain carrying anything heavy, darn Tamox and everything else. I feel like a chemical zombie
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Re: Soya is 83% GMO
19 Studies Link GMO Foods to Organ Disruption
A new paper demonstrates that consuming genetically modified (GM) food leads to significant organ disruptions in rats and mice. Researchers reviewed data from 19 studies and found that parameters including blood and urine biochemistry and organ weights were significantly disrupted in the GM-fed animals.
The kidneys of males were the most affected, experiencing 43.5 percent of all the changes. The livers of females followed at more than 30 percent. Other organs may have been affected too, including the heart and spleen, and blood cells.
According to the Institute for Responsible Technology:
"The GM soybean and corn varieties used in the feeding trials 'constitute 83 percent of the commercialized GMOs' that are currently consumed by billions of people. While the findings may have serious ramifications for the human population, the authors demonstrate how a multitude of GMO-related health problems could easily pass undetected through the superficial and largely incompetent safety assessments that are used around the world."
Further, the biotechnology firm Monsanto is only an FDA approval away from its latest monstrosity -- soybeans that have been genetically modified to produce omega-3 fats. That FDA approval is expected this year.
Monsanto plans to include GM soybean oil in every product it can -- baked goods, baking mixes, breakfast cereals, cheeses, frozen dairy desserts, pasta, gravies and sauces, fruit juices, snack foods, candy, soups, and more.
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Can someone provide more information on the chamomile tea link to phytoestrogens? I have been drinking a lot of chammomile because I was told to avoid green tea due to the antioxidents effecting how well hormone therapy/radiation would work.
What about cookware? Any issues with the non-stick stuff in regard to BC?
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anyone else notice how Monsanto is close to the word monster? or monstrous?
This news infuriates me. All of the money/time/print and energy spent lecturing women on "prevention" when our very food is so polluted. We are seriously at a disadvantage, at least in this country. I don't care what docs say: my gene mutation predisposed me to cancer, but my hormone laden milk/meat/grains etc. did NOT help.
I love "Anti Cancer" - he explains this whole process so well.
Sunscreen is a tough one for me. I love the beach. Spend most of my time in the summer outdoors. I find the "natural" sunscreens make me break out, while also making me look like a ghost. and the cost is ridiculous, esp. given how much i use for myself and 2 children. Anyone have a good "natural" sunscreen recommendation?
Luan, thanks for the carotenoid list! very helpful.
staying away from flax for sure, now. i don't touch soy - never did.
this is a great thread.
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Ugh! GMO is so wrong on so many levels. No wonder all of our hormones are under attack being disrupted and mimicked.
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heathermcd: re chamomile, here is one of the sources: http://ijms.sums.ac.ir/files/PDFfiles/35_2_06-Dr.%20Noorafshan.pdf
As for non-stick cookware, alternatives can be found, i.e. as in ceramic surface:
https://www.orgreenicsale.com/?mid=983247
Elmcity69 - you're quite welcome, I'm happy when I can help
Have you tried Burt's Bees ? Chemical-Free Sunscreen SPF30 - 3.5 fl. oz. - High protection from the sun's harmful rays, naturally.This 100% natural, non-whitening formula provides broad-spectrum UVA/UVB protection and helps keep skin hydrated without using chemical sunscreen actives like octinoxate and oxybenzone. Instead, titanium dioxide, a naturally-occurring mineral creates a micro-fine barrier on your skin to reflect the sun's harmful rays. Our natural sunscreen is effective immediately upon application and safe for kids.
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Very interesting! Valgirl thank you for the website to foodforbreastcancer I'll look thank up.
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thanks, luan - i;ll try the burt's bees! i do love my coppertone, though...the smell reminds me of childhood summers at the beach. sigh.
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THERE IS HOPE !!!
Through groundbreaking, transdisciplinary discovery and outreach, the N.C. State University Plants for Human Health Institute (PHHI) is pioneering a dramatic shift in the way the American public views and uses plant food crops, not merely as a source of nutrients and calories, but as a powerful resource for components that protect and enhance human health and well-being.
Integrated research in metabolomics, biochemistry, pharmacogenomics, breeding and postharvest attributes will lead to development of mainstream fruits, vegetables and natural products containing bioactives with enhanced health benefits.
http://plantsforhumanhealth.ncsu.edu/research/
This will allow consumers to make proactive, responsible dietary choices that benefit their own, and their family's, health
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elmcity- About sunscreens, I agree there are just way too many weird chemicals in them. Many years ago, when my son was little, we started wearing the UV protective swimwear from Australia. Everyone in Australia wears these. They provide complete protection and look very cool. The brand I liked best was Sharkskin or Sharksuit or something, it's online. The Australian brands have to meet certain standards (tons of skincancer there). I use the womens swimshirt and their hats are great, you can evern swim in them.
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designermom, it's funny, but i think i'm going to stick with the uv swimshirt i purchased last summer due to radiation treatment! i was so sure i would run back to my usual swimsuits.i grumbled plenty about the UV wear --i'm a gal who buys a new swimsuit (or 2, or whatever!) every summer, much to hubby's bewilderment-- but in the end, it was nice to play on the beach all day without worrying about the inevitable back and shoulder burns. Athleta has very pretty options. Will definitely check out the Australian brands for my little blondie, who is 10yo and burns as I always did. My 13yo is a bit browner, like my husband, and is at the age where fashion is everything. Thank God she doesn't fuss about sunscreen, although she loves to sunbathe. Have to admit, I do too...love the feel of sun on my skin. Sigh.
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ps: have the Burt's Bees tinted lip balm - verrrry nice, great colors, and no crazy additives. yahoo!
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Elmcity~ I have all of the new Burt's bees lipbalms (a gift) and I am loving them too!
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Turmeric has been strongly linked to being protective against breast cancer. Where is the info that it should be avoided? It's very anti-inflammatory and has been shown to inhibit breast cancer cell proliferation.
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Yes, I have the same question as calamtykel on Turmeric having to be avoided (and pomegranate too?)
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I am so confused as well, although I guess what this site is saying is that it is estrogenic? My DIM has curcumin in it so it just seems odd. I also adore pomegranate and am not giving them up, lol, wasn't there just news that it was protective agains't BC and recurrence? My mind spins sometimes haha!
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I avoid soy, meat, wheat and pasteurized dairy - we have raw milk from a local farm without any hormones added, etc. I avoid these things since they are inflammatory foods. That being said, as far as estrogen, I asked the first oncologlist I saw about soy and he said that in his opinion, a woman's body pumps out so much estrogen that what foods would add are miniscule in comparison. I still avoid the soy though, and things that could have added hormones.
Like some of the above posters, I am far more concerned with chemicals and endocrine disrupters. I think those are the real culprits, since whole natural foods have been around for all of human history and only recently do we have a breast cancer epidemic.
Also, using a progesterone cream is very protective of breast cells and estrogen receptors.
Unfortunately I am node positive and was unable to take tamoxifen due to a fairly severe reaction, so I'm having to go about reducing my risk in other ways... -
Re: Curcuma (Cúr-cu-ma) is a genus of about 80 accepted species in the plant family Zingiberaceae that contains such species as turmeric and Siam Tulip. The name comes from Arabic kurkum (كركم) meaning "turmeric".
http://pdfcast.org/search/all/turmeric-phytoestrogen
http://www.fasebj.org/cgi/content/meeting_abstract/24/1_MeetingAbstracts/1028.8
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20364372
http://www.academicjournals.org/jmpr/PDF/pdf2010/18Dec/Keeratinijakal%20et%20al.pdf
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