Radiation with Tissue Expanders

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This is my first post regarding my BC......which was diagnosed in July 09.  Had a lumpectomy and lymph node removal.  During testing for a study, another tumor was found close to my chest wall.

I just had a BLM on 1/28/10.  Before the surgery I was advised I would need Radiation under my arm due to 4+ lymph nodes.  I opted for immediate recon with tissue expanders.  Now that the pathology report is back, it appears I need Radiation on the chest wall as the tumor was too close.  My expanders have not been filled at all yet.  How is Radiation going to affect my tissue expanders.  Should I have them filled before I begin Radiation?  I'm sooo confused.

Comments

  • rayofsun
    rayofsun Member Posts: 204
    edited February 2010

    i have heard different things r/t this and depends on your doctor. I do believe that there is more concern with radiation and actual implants than the expanders.

  • RegulJ
    RegulJ Member Posts: 244
    edited February 2010

    Also consider that the geometry of your body changes with each expansion and this will effect how radiation is done.

  • econmom
    econmom Member Posts: 73
    edited February 2010

    Hi Jane,

    I had a bilateral with expanders, knowing that I would likely need radiation.  I had several fills prior to starting rads  (surgery 11/2008, rads started January 2009).  Then I healed for 9 months and had a few more fills every few weeks.  I had my exchange surgery for saline implants on 11/2009 and so far am very happy with the look (symmetry with radiated and nonradiated side)  and the site healed well.

    My PS has had a lot of success with implants in radiated skin because he takes a slow approach, I think.

  • ps123
    ps123 Member Posts: 221
    edited February 2010

    It seems to depend on  your rad onc but my rad onc and plastic surgeon wanted me fully expanded before beginning  rads.  I had chemo first, then surgery, then rads; so had to be expanded quickly in order to start rads on time.  Rads can effect the elasticity of your skin so if you don't do any of the expanding before rads it might be more difficult to do the  expansion.  You can't do rads and get expansion at the same time, though, because like Regulj said; rads are very carefully mapped out so and change made by expanding would change the rads.  I had no problem with my tissue expander and rad.  Good luck!

    Pat

  • lexislove
    lexislove Member Posts: 2,645
    edited February 2010

    I had rads with my tissue expander in place.

    I had about 275 cc's when I started rads. I was told NOT to have any fills during the rads and to wait atleast 8 weeks post rads to continue with fills.

    I finished rads 1st week of July 2008 and just had my exchange surgery 2 weeks ago. I was in no rush to get filled and I wanted to make sure my skin could stretch well.

    I handled rads very well. I apllied cream 2-3x a day and had no blisters or redness, just slightly pink. Skin healed good.

    So far I like the look of my implant...I did develop a slight infection a couple of days ago, but that antibiotics seem to be taking care of things. Lets hope it stays that way.

    *I do feel that it is important not to rush to get your exchange surgery, especially if you are doing rads. You want the skin to heal as much as possibe. I was told to wait a good year ( i waited 18 months)*

  • Dragonfly92127
    Dragonfly92127 Member Posts: 106
    edited February 2010

    Jane

    I opted for implant recon knowing that I needed radiation.  We had me over-expanded before rads.  Gave it a few months to heal then deflated a little for the remaining 4 months until we exchanged.  Both my PS and I were really pleased with the result.  Fortunately for me my PS listened to me when I brought him my research from other PS's ideas and findings and we had complete success for the expansion. Smile  I used Emu oil during rads and continued through the exchange.

    The exchange itself was not so good.  Even though I had a skin sparing mas the lower portion of my breast tissue was pretty thin so that the PS had to suture the incision to my pec muscle for support. Not pretty.  Original PS is out on his own med leave so I am currently researching my options with other PS's.  Didn't want to but it looks like I'll need to go with the LD.  I will say that both of the PS I have interviewed commented on the amount and quality of skin for the procedure. Both said that they have never seen radiatied skin with so little damage.   They both think that I will have great success using the LD muscle but needing little or no skin transfer.

    I believe that the over expansion before rads was crucial and I moisturize like crazy.  Almost 2 years out from treatment and I still use the emu oil regularly.

    Research Reasearch Reasearch then follow your heart.

    Sue Ellen

  • TonLee
    TonLee Member Posts: 2,626
    edited April 2011

    Looks like I'm getting radiation to:

    1.  Super Clav

    2.  Chest Wall

    3.  Axilla (with boosts from the back)

    4.  Skin (w/Bolice (sp?) gel)

    Anyone have that much radiation and KEEP their TEs?  My Rad Onc isn't very optimistic it's going to work out.  Says if I don't lose it, the rads will make the boob very ugly.

  • Letlet
    Letlet Member Posts: 1,053
    edited April 2011

    TonLee, my PS said that if I would be radiated with TE's then he would wait 3-6 months AFTER rads "depending" on how my skin is before having the exchange.

  • Pegs
    Pegs Member Posts: 198
    edited April 2011

    TonLee,

    I had almost the same rads as you , except not the axilla.  my skin did pretty good i have some discoloration to that side but its not big deal, i finished my rads in january and getting my exchange 4/27 yahoo!! my suggestion is put whatever lotions they tell you to use, use them a lot, i used aquaphor - hated it very greasy and ruined a lot of shirts, i tried aloe but i felt it dried me out, i did find emu oil and really liked it, my rad onc never heard of it , but i think it worked better than anything else.  i had 28 treatments of rads.  the bolice is where i burnt the most and i must say it hurt like hell.  for about a week or so.  the emu oil i swear it healed me better than anything else i am still putting it on, its making my scars a lot lighter.   good luck

  • TonLee
    TonLee Member Posts: 2,626
    edited April 2011

    Pegs,

    Thank you so much for that info!!

    Right now I'm going back and forth with the Rad Onc because I have an open wound and he STILL wants to start aggressive rads in 4 weeks.  I am 3 weeks out of chemo, and even when chemo wasn't in my system...I heal SLOOOOOW.  No way I will be ready in 4 weeks.

    Not to mention I have to be filled after healing!!

    He basically said he's not concerned with my reconstruction, he's concerned with preventing a recurrence.  Then he told me that studies show I should be in radiation no more than 6 months after MX.  WT?  I have found several articles that say there is a 12 week window after chemo for rads...(though some still say 4-6 weeks)....I also spoke with the head of radiology there and he said 12 weeks wouldn't increase my risk of recurrence significantly.

    I feel rushed. 

  • Pegs
    Pegs Member Posts: 198
    edited April 2011

    TonLee,

    Are they giving you something to put on the open wound?  maybe you should just wait and see how the healing goes for a few weeks and then decide.  when you say after healing you have to be filled, do you mean your expanders, from my experience my rad. onc wanted me to be completed expanded before i even started radiation, because the skin does get somewhat tighter.  i dont know much about radiation and time frame to prevent recurrence, but i finished chemo a week before thanksgiving and the rad onc. had me start rad the first week in december so i did feel they don't like a lot of time to pass by.  i felt like the process from the beginning has been rushed, when i met with the onc. doctor he had me start chemo the next week, i was shocked i didnt expect it to happen so quickly, i guess thats how most of the doctors do things.  i think you should go with your gut, after all its our bodies they are messing with.  but who am i, certainly not a doctor.  take care

  • TonLee
    TonLee Member Posts: 2,626
    edited April 2011

    Pegs,

    I am refusing to have radiation until I'm healed.  Period.

    Yes, my PS wants me fully expanded before radiation.  I do too. 

    The Rad Onc told me sometimes he "makes" the PS remove some of the fluid from an expander so he can get a better angel on the Rads machine.  I told him, fat chance.  What does he do with women who have lumpectomys and have the same size boob as mine?  Tell them to deflate them?

    I'm getting a second (really third) opinion.

    I've researched the time frame from chemo to rads after MX, and could only find one article that said 12 weeks is acceptable.  I misplaced it, so now I'm scrambling to find it to take in to the Rad Onc.  Most of the studies are done with lumpectomies and I guess they just use those...but I'm still looking.

    He kept saying, "I'm worried about you.  You've had so much trouble following standard of care (I refused axilla dissection and Benadryl with chemo..oooooo ain't I scary, heh), I'm concerned for your survival."

  • Pegs
    Pegs Member Posts: 198
    edited April 2011

    I too would get another opinion. i don't think i would like your rad onc doctor either.  i have heard of rad onc having fluid removed from expanders but i would not have done that either.  how big are your expanders now?  i had 3 different opinions on getting radiation, i tried like hell to avoid it but each doctor said get it.  but the one doctor i went to , i asked him a question and he said i will be right back, he came in with some printed material from the internet and while we were both reading he said and i quote " we are both learning"  i left and never went back. 

  • TonLee
    TonLee Member Posts: 2,626
    edited April 2011

    I have one TE on the right side.  It has about 150 cc...and to match my left side it will need 500-550 total.  So I'm looking at several fills.

    One of you second Rads opinions sounds like one of my MO's.  I couldn't get out of there fast enough.

    I'm going to push for waiting until healed and filled.  But then I'm going to have all of it done I think, even the Bolice.  I heard it is really painful, but I don't want to dance with cancer again.

    I'll keep ya posted! 

  • Yjack62
    Yjack62 Member Posts: 1
    edited April 2011

    Hello.  I had radiation with TE.  Rads needed to deflate the expander opposite to the one being radiated so that the beam can get the correct angle.  If someone had natural breasts they could use pressure/weight to move the breast tissue out of the way.  With a TE, as you know, they don't move so there is no way to get the correct angle for the beam without deflation...sorry!

  • TonLee
    TonLee Member Posts: 2,626
    edited April 2011

    Yjack,

    I only have one TE..not two.  So they can use pressure on my other breast to move it out of the way.

  • CLYDAY
    CLYDAY Member Posts: 81
    edited May 2013

    Hi ladies....I really feel like some how there was a miscommunication with my PS and RO.  I am to start RADS Tues and the PS delfated the side that will be radiated?? That just doesnt make sense to me! I have a call in to my RO....I really feel that trying to expand the radiated side is going to be more difficult!!

  • fd1
    fd1 Member Posts: 239
    edited May 2013

    Yes, as far as I know, there is no reason to deflate the side to be radiated!  My plastic surgeon was in a rush to inflate it as much as possible before radiation as further expansion is more difficult after.

  • liefie
    liefie Member Posts: 2,440
    edited May 2013

    My PS fully inflated the TE before my 25 rads. We then waited 15 months to do a DIEP flap, and PS was pleasantly surprised to find that radiation had not done the amount of damage she expected. DIEP surgery was a huge success. The way this was done obviously worked well for me.

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