I say yes, you say no, OR People are Strange

Your trip sounds wonderful. Hope you all have a lovely time!

Blue - what kind of dogs do you have?  Mine are mixed breed - shelter mutts.   2 dogs, (only)1 cat currently.   I don't know what I would do w/o an animal.

Well revkat I happen to disagree but regardless all of Soetoro's personal information will be released by next year and we shall see who was right...........

Oh and 2z welcome back............Shokk

Obama-Derangement Syndrome at its worst. LOL.  I heard that he is actually a Manchurian Candidate planted here by the Pharoahs, Stalin and Lenin.  They conspired with Satan to take over the world.  LOL!!!!

I thought the new thing was the Babylonian Caliphate. Somehow, this tiny Kenyan baby with the Indonesian last name was born just to become the US president and then let this 12 Imam take over the US with Sharia law. . . or something. It's hard to keep straight.

But so much easier to believe than that a bi-racial child was born a US citizen in Hawaii and grew up to become president.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but not their own facts. Unfortunately, it has become difficult for some to discern the difference between the two.

I think one of the reason people in the US don't travel abroad more is sheer geographical distance. I can get to Mexico in a few hours, but to the west Asia is a 12 hour flight away, to the east Europe is a bit more, and even Canada, to the north is about 1500 miles away. I also think there has been a generational shift. I bet that people under 30 are much more likely to have traveled outside the US. I know that is true for my young adult relatives. 

So, ya'll think with this new Health Care Law that no one will go bankrupt?  That everyone will be able to afford to buy a plan?  That plans that cover pre-existing conditions will be affordable?  That states will be able to afford to take on more Medicaid patients?  That by the government demanding more coverage for more things, e.g. adult children on parent's plans, free yearly physicals, and other free "stuff" the government wants included will not increase premiums.  My insurance already includes the free "stuff" as long as it not diagnostic.  Like I could have an bone density every two years but since I now have osteopenia in my hips, my density tests will be considered diagnostic.

This is not a good law...it is a thrown together law and passed in such a way that the American people do not like it.  It's fruitless to show poll numbers and talk about how bad this law is. 

Welcome back Kindergarden. No harm no foul. Apology accepted.

Snopes, the organization that researches Urban legends and other false statements has this to say about the citizenship of President Obama.  Please note that the Supreme Court of the United States refused to hear a challenge of this subject.  The SCOTUS is predominately Republican and was unanimous in denying cert. 

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/occidental.asp

At first I thought people were bringing this up based on his name.  Since the facts of his American birth have been repeatedly proven, I now think that this has more to do with the color of his skin than his birth. 

What suprises me is that not one hospital employee has stepped forward to say he or she remembers the birth of a bi-racial child to a very young white American mother married to an "older" African father in the early 1960's.  Today that would barely be noticed, but back then it was far from common, and I suspect that at least one of the nurses or orderlies would remember. 

My kids need to present their official state issued birth certificates to get a driver's permit, or a state issued ID.  Anyone applying for a job must present a Social Security Card to prove that he/she can legally be hired in this country.  My husband and I need to present them to his employer to qualify for retirement benefits.  Why is there such an uproar about requesting someone whose job's only qualifiying requirements are age and location of birth present an official state issued birth certificate to prove that he is qualified for the job?  If there is nothing amiss, why spend millions to keep them secret rather than just producing them and putting all the speculation to rest?

He definitely used the name Barry Soetoro consistently throughout his school years.  He seems to have reverted to using Barak Obama in college. 

A really horrific crisis could occur if Obama is not using his legal name to sign legislation.  Potentially every executive order and every bill signed into law since he became President could be overturned in the judicial system. 

If he were found to be not qualified to serve, that could create an even more intense constitutional crisis, and then we'd have President Biden.

Revkat, please cite your source that his widely reported adoption by his stepfather Lolo Soetoro was not legal. 

1Athena1 wrote: He's still president, and you are not.

Thank God for the second half of that statement.  I wouldn't want that job, and I think anyone who does has to have some big issues and a really big ego.

Patmom I am not going to source anything I said, because I know that you would then pick at the sources. Anyone beginning with the point that Barack Obama is not the legal name of our native born president is not likely to be swayed by any kind of evidence.

As I said in my post, it was not for the birthers, but for anyone else who wandered by. 

Edited to add: Like many children from blended families, Barack Obama used his stepfather's last name and his stepfather treated him like his son during the 5 years he lived with his stepfather in Indonesia. Prior to that, and after that (when he returned to the US and lived with his grandparents from age 10 on) he used his legal name, Obama.

Maybe you are the one who should source your evidence that anything I have posted is not true since you are the one making these outrageous claims. Evidence would need to come from unbiased sources, not those funded fully by right-wing individuals and organizations! 

Konakat -- You've seen a lot of the world but something's missing -- get thee to Europe!  Italy, especially - spectacular scenery, fabulous food, wonderful people, so MUCH to see, do, eat and appreciate!  I've had a passport since 1972.  Travelling outside your home base truly makes you appreciate and stand in awe of the world, and, incidentally, your own country in particular.  Agreed?

Thank God for big egos and naivete - both of which sometimes go together. Because we skeptics get to sit here and write while the Barak Obamas of the world sacrifice everything for their country. Of course he adores himself, but if that is what he needs in order to do the best job that he knows how to do for our country, then more power to him.

Pat, I am sorry that we meet thus, because your profile has long interested me. We both have comorbidities. I know that mine affected my cancer treatment decisions. I have long wondered if yours did. I am always casting around for sisters like you and Blue who have these other diseases and I wonder and wonder how cancer stacks up in your minds and if you ever feel, like I do, that sometimes you have nothing in common with other BC patients on so many things having to do with medical decisionmaking. I read somewhere that you had an oncotype dx of 50 and did not do chemo (if I am wrong, I apologize). My assumption is that you were probably advised to do so and refused - just like me. I refused too (I didn't have the test - I was just advised based on my cancer profile). And then I see your signature, which I really like,  and put it all together and --I am finally getting to the point, so bear with me-- I wonder whether the awful comorbidity has imbued you with a sort of wisdom that few can really understand. I know mine has done that to me. Not that I am a particularly wise person, but I am less unwise than I would be without it. The moral of the story is that a "weakness" can be a strength and, on reading your profile, I sensed that you must know it.... 

.....and, back to the subject at hand, Obama's ego and naivete are, to me, amongst his weakness that are his greatest strengths because those have enabled him to lead the country at a crisis time like this and put up with so much of the hatred. He has courage like a lion. 

And (I say this not to Pat in particular but to whoever reads this): I know many people here absolutely loathe him. I admire him. I am Caucasian, but bi-national and tri-cultural, and the fact that Barak has managed to lead this country and survive so much hate and desire to cast him into the ocean says a lot about the man. He is a role model to me for his serenity and levelheadedness. He has a cultural comorbidity, you could say, and it affects his decisions as a politician in a way that few can understand. I feel I know him, so I trust him - and I never succumb to sentiments like that for anyone, so this is ridiculously unusual for me. I disagree and even rail against some of his decisions, but I knew, in early 2007, that  he would anger me because he is not a liberal, but significantly to the right of me. First time I ever raise money for a candidate in my life was Obama. First time I make political calls. If you had any idea how much I hate engaging in political activity other than opening my bvig mouth about my opinions, and asking people in the south (long distance calls) to vote for a black man, you would know what this means to me. I voted for him with tears in my eyes.

I don't care what his name is, who his mother or father were, and as for his so-called foreign birth, I merely look at who disputes his US citizenship (people like Orly Tates -sp?) and, just by that, I know that he must be a citizen. 

And I know why - but am sad - that whenever the topic of healthcare comes up, it eventually devolves into a discussion of American-ness vs. foreign-ness. I believe race is hugely at issue, but I hesitate to emphasize that because I have no right to even suggest that anyone who doesn't like Obama is a racist. And race is not even as big an issue as culture. It is the Rand Pauls versus those who are in the 21st century. The healthcare law is quite 21st century. I am sure Jefferson would roll over in his grave. That is OK by me because I know that George Washington and FDR would not. 

I am the QUEEN of typos, so I may edit this and every post a million times. Running out now. Cheers. 

Absolutely agree that it opens the mind.  And makes one realize that we basically are all the same -- want to have a decent life, family, feel safe and content.  I lost my desire for Europe, but I wouldn't turn down a free trip though.  I was thinking of Tanzania -- Olduvai Gorge, the Serengeti.  But I realized all the animals wouldn't be friends like a Disney movie and I didn't want to see that. 

I reallllly want to see some great white sharks.  In Sept they're feeding on walruses (or some sort of big seals) off an island near San Fran but it sounds pretty gruesome.  Maybe after they're finished gorging and looking for a couch to nap on and a cuddle?

My tastes revolve around nature, not humankind so much anymore.