Does the swelling ever go away????

Options
nannajean
nannajean Member Posts: 25
edited June 2014 in Lymphedema

I have had LE for the past 6 months, I've had a compression sleeve and glove, massage therapy and physio and I am not seeing too much improvement.  Since BC I have gained about 20 pounds and I am wondering if this is part of the cause.  I want all your advice on if this will ever go away, maybe not to the original size of my other arm but close to it.  I am on Femera and have heard that it can cause some water retention, also I flew to Toyko and back without a sleeve, then I really noticed that my arm was swelling.

Help you guys you all have been through this, give my some advise.

Nannajean

Comments

  • kira66715
    kira66715 Member Posts: 4,681
    edited January 2011

    Nannajean, in my experience, it gets better, but everyone is different. If you are working hard at controlling your lymphedema (and I hope that Toyko flight was a while ago) and not making progress, then it's time for a re-evaluation with your lymphedema therapist.

    And, if your lymphedema therapist isn't a great fit with you, time to look for another one.

    This is frustrating stuff, so lack of progress is disheartening and upsetting.

     http://www.stepup-speakout.org/Finding_a_Qualified_Lymphedema_Therapist.htm

    Even therapists re-certify, so they are checked in their skills, so we often need a re-evaluation.

    I don't see that you're wrapping or using a night sleeve--and those are critical components of bringing down the swelling--compression sleeves just maintain. If you're not wrapping or have a custom garment that simulates wrapping, IMO, you should strongly consider it.

    http://www.stepup-speakout.org/wrapping_bandaging_for_lymphedema.htm

    Kira

  • nannajean
    nannajean Member Posts: 25
    edited January 2011

    Hi Kira

    Thanks for the advise, I am wrapping and I do have a night sleeve (it looks like a elephant nose warmer- (ugh) but I wear it each night and wrap for about 2-3 hours each day and compression sleeve a couple of hours a day but if I go out or shopping I leave most of the stuff at home.  I just feel this is taking up way too much of my life and I don't know if it is doing much good. It quite honestly scares me that I will have to continue with this forever.  I want to leave the Cancer and it's baggage behind me.

    Nannajean

  • Binney4
    Binney4 Member Posts: 8,609
    edited January 2011

    Aw, Nannajean, I hear you! I'm so sorry you've joined our Sorority of Swell!Frown It's a HUGE adjustment to come to grips with the "forever" part -- way too big a concept to deal with all at once. Grieving is hard work, and it takes time -- be gentle with yourself.Kiss

    Nanna, have you tried doing the compression (wrapping or garments) all day, even when you're going out? It's rotten, but you need to know if that works for you or not, so you can make your self-treatment decisions more freely. We all make our own compromises with the self-care, but we can't really choose what we want to do about it unless we know for sure what works. If you've given it a fair trial and it isn't working, you definitely need to ask for more help from your therapist, or a second opinion from another one.

    We all need to leave the cancer behind and move on. With lymphedema that comes from learning all the management tricks we can and staying on top of it, so we can take back control of our lives.You'll get there, Nannajean -- hang in there! Please tell us how we can help!

    Okay, gotta add here that I laughed out loud about the elephant nose warmer. Now I know what to do with mine when I get new ones to replace them. I'll just call the zoo...!Laughing

    Warm hugs,
    Binney

  • kira66715
    kira66715 Member Posts: 4,681
    edited January 2011

    Nana, I SO get it--I mostly have my LE in my hand, and until I broke that hand in October, I would not wear a glove in public, unless taking a hike or exercising.

    Now, I have to--and I've had more time to get used to it.

    But, I wake up mornings wrapped, and there's a moment when I first wake up, when I'm MAD, just furious that I have to deal with this.

    Before I broke my hand, I was doing really, really well--and it was due to the time and effort I put into it, and the first few times I wore compression in public I thought everyone was looking at me, and they're not.

    It's ironic, but to get to leave it behind, we have have to deal with it today. But everyone has their comfort levels.

    Don't know when I'll ever "accept" it--but it's a work in progress.

    Kira

  • KittyDog
    KittyDog Member Posts: 1,079
    edited January 2011

    Well I am new to this stuff still too.  I was DX last Sept.  I can  tell you that wrapping does help if you do it all day for two weeks and sleep in  your elephant nose warmer.  lol   I didn't believe it until the past two weeks.  I have been back in the  LE Clinic getting my arm back down.  I too take Femara.  I have wondered if that is causing some of the extra swelling that I am having all over. Oh joy if it isn't one thing it is another.   I have two more days of  the having to wrap  and I can say  my arm feels better and she was able to not use  one of the bandages yesterday and today.

  • lindee629
    lindee629 Member Posts: 61
    edited January 2011

    Hi everyone...well here is another group I can join! I've already been on the Feb chemo group, the June rads group, the Tamoxifen group, and now I have lymphedema. I had my lumpectomy and axillary LN dissection a year ago and thought I was out of the woods. But in early Dec I noticed my hand was swollen and my arm looked "thick". Went to see a LE therapist and she taught me how to bandage and I had manual compression therapy--both of which have really reduced the swelling, but I too am upset at knowing that I have to deal with this for the rest of my life. Like having cancer wasn't enough. Today I got my compression garment (I have to wear the sleeve as well as a gauntlet) and at least it looks and feels better than those bulky bandages. I just can't get it in my head that I will have to wear this forever. My therapist did give me a booklet from a company that makes "lymphaDivas" --designer sleeves with different patterns.  I'm trying to get excited about maybe getting one of them in the future (black lace? leopard print? flower garden?) but its going to be hard to deal with this when the weather gets nice and I want to go to the beach or wear a t-shirt.

    Sigh.  Breast cancer--the gift that keeps on giving..... 

  • kira66715
    kira66715 Member Posts: 4,681
    edited January 2011

    Lindee, welcome to the group no one wants to join--the swell sisters. It sounds like you're on top of your lymphedema and well on your way to getting it under control.

    I went to the NLN conference with Jane/OneBadBoob in September and she was so gorgeous in her LymphaDiva sleeves that people took pictures. She's so stylish and they really looked great.

    Wearing compression in public is hard--it really is--but it gets easier. And every woman's need for compression varies---my LE therapist always says that you get things under control and then you see what you can get away with.

    Welcome, and yeah, it is the gift that keeps giving. But I wish I could show you a picture of Jane in her Diva sleeves and gauntlets and how beautiful she looked/looks.

    Kira

  • alex56
    alex56 Member Posts: 136
    edited January 2011

    I have the leopard print and black lace sleeves and they are awesome!  Can't wait to get the spring designs in a few months!  I'm making peace with the meaning of 'forever' with respect to LE, but no doubt about it, it's a struggle.  Hang in there everyone!

  • nannajean
    nannajean Member Posts: 25
    edited January 2011

    You know it just makes things better to know that you are not the only one dealing with this stuff.  I would love for the swelling to be gone but I am glad that I am here to experience this, it is for a reason and we are at least alive.  I do wrap (not the music kind) and it does help but maybe I need to wrap for 2 weeks solid and just stay around home for that time.

    You guys rock (not the music kind) I don't know what I would do without you all,

    Thanks

    Nannajean

  • Tamara67646
    Tamara67646 Member Posts: 293
    edited January 2011

    I am also a recent  member to this group.  I was 2 1/2 years out from my surgery and thought that I was past having to worry about lymphedema but over Thanksgiving developed swelling.  I have been in PT since mid-December and almost all of the swelling has gone down - only one stubborn area around my elbow is still at 1cm larger than before.  I have been doing the self massage, stretching exercies and wearing the sleeve except for sleeping and showering. 

     I was worried about wearing the sleeve in public and I work at a job where I interact with alot of different people everyday so I thought I would have to keep explaining the sleeve.  But, actually it hasn't been too bad.  Some people ask about it but most don't and most assume I have tendinitis or carpel tunnel.  When asked about the sleeve -if it is someone I know well and the circumstances appropriate - I educate them on lymphadema but otherwise I just say that it is to reduce some swelling I have in that arm and move on to another topic.  Of course - it is long sleeve weather right now and less noticiable - I  may not be as comfortable in short sleeves in the summer and am really worried about our annual Hawaii vacation where we spend hours at the beach.  Oh well, cross that bridge when I get to it. 

    Thanks to all of you who post so much valuable information here - it has been very helpful to come back to this site and find support and information.  

  • mrsnjband
    mrsnjband Member Posts: 1,409
    edited January 2011

    I didn't like wearing my sleeve at first but I finally became resolved to wearing it.  I actually enjoy wearing as it helps to desenstize (sp) the nerve pain in my arm (from lymph node disection).  I started LE mld and for awhile wearing it was painful right at the top of the sleeve.  Thankfully that is going away now & I am enjoying my sleeve again.  It took awhile to get this way, but I don't really care what it looks like or what other people think.  My comfort it most inportant thing for me.  NJ

  • kira66715
    kira66715 Member Posts: 4,681
    edited January 2011

    Tamara--it sounds like you're doing really well with therapy--it's only been a few weeks and most of the swelling is gone--great results!

    Wearing compression is public is hard--I try and imagine I'm a pro basketball player--they're wearing compression sleeves, compression socks--it seems like more every day.

    I agree with Norma Jean about comfort--I used to hide my glove, but now that I broke my hand and really need it, I just figure it's something I need--and my hand feels better with it on.

    So, welcome to the swell club, and I'm sorry you joined it, but it sure sounds like you're doing great, and bringing things under control quickly.

    And it doesn't sound at though your PT has you using wrapping or custom night garment to reduce swelling--they're valuable tools.

    http://www.stepup-speakout.org/wrapping_bandaging_for_lymphedema.htm

    Some women here find the LymphaDiva sleeves a nice alternative to "beige"--although Juzo does make various colored Dream Sleeves. 

    Just remember, a sleeve isn't a high SPF--so you can get sunburned with one on, and need to still protect your skin in Hawaii.

    Let us know how you're doing when you.

    Kira

  • Binney4
    Binney4 Member Posts: 8,609
    edited January 2011

    Nannajean, sometimes in the middle of doing something else, while I'm away from the computer, it hits me that you asked about weight loss and LE, and nobody has answered that. So, hooray for me for remembering it this time while I'm sitting here -- another chemo-brain triumph!

    Research shows that weight gain, especially weight gained since the bc surgery, is a risk factor for lymphedema development.Frown

    BUT! On the positive side, losing weight (even 5 or 10 pounds) benefits LE control, so as you lose weight you'll be working toward making this whole thing easier to manage.Smile

    Yes!Cool

    Well...then again, weight loss sure as heck isn't easy either!Tongue out

    Go for it anyhow!
    Binney

  • nannajean
    nannajean Member Posts: 25
    edited January 2011

    Hi Brinny

    I was just at physio and my affected arm is not any different but my good arm (the one with all it's nodes) has increased by 1cm in all 4 spots that she measured.  She says that of course can't be because of Lymphedemia and she is pretty sure I am retaining water.  Have any of you ladies had water retentsion from being on Femera.  I have an appt with the family dr. next Friday and I am going to ask about a water pill.  Any thoughts on this, all you wise ladies.

    Thanks again

    Nannajean

  • Tamara67646
    Tamara67646 Member Posts: 293
    edited January 2011

    Kira,

    Thank you for the response.  My PT hasn't used the wrapping yet - since the swelling was mild and the sleeve and massage seemed to be getting under control - we decided to wait on the wrapping.  If I stop making progress with just the sleeve and massage - she suggested trying night sleeves and/or wrapping.  She also has me using some foam "chips" on the stubborn spot by my elbow at night.  Seems odd - but it has helped too. 

    When I bought sleeves right after my surgery - I got one in a bright blue but never wore it and now it seems too tight.  I have been wearing the beige one I got at the same time and had worn several times when flying - it is more stretched out from wearing, I assume.  I am working at getting re-fitted though since it has been 2 1/2 years since I bought those.   I have seen other providers that have a variety of colors in the custom sleeves but beige is easier than trying to match sleeves and clothes!  

    I don't burn easily but have gotton much better about protecting at least that side when in the sun - I have a oversized shirt that has that sun block fabric that I wear as a cover up.  Anything to be aware of when picking out sunblock if I am wearing the sleeve?  I wasn't sure if lotions etc were a problem with the sleeves.

    Thanks

    Tamara

  • kira66715
    kira66715 Member Posts: 4,681
    edited January 2011

    Tamara--soundls like time for new sleeves! They are only supposed to last 6 months, but that's with regular wearing. It also sounds like a good time to be measured, as you're essentially back to normal size.

    The foam chips break up fibrosis--and night garments are stuffed with foam chips.

    I just put lotion on about 5 minutes before I put on my gloves, so they don't get all goopy. I don't think the sunblock will damage the sleeve--I'd just wait a few minutes before you put it on.

    Enjoy your trip, and I hope you have or get a gauntlet or glove for flying.

    Here's the explanation for why you cover the hand with a sleeve, written by Andrea Cheville, for the LynphaDivas

    http://lymphedivas.com/lymphedema/gauntletandsleeve/

    Have a great trip!

    Kira

  • IHOP
    IHOP Member Posts: 79
    edited January 2011

    Hi, I have had swelling shortly after node removal.  It stayed moderate until about a week ago when I was bitten by a spider on that arm.  Now it has literally doubled in size.  I was searching for treatment updates when I found this site.  I guess I was hoping that they had made improvements in treating lymphedema without full time wrapping.  Does anyone know of any new treatments in the works???

  • kira66715
    kira66715 Member Posts: 4,681
    edited January 2011

    Darlene, treatment is individualized--the classic treatment is "complete decongestive therapy" and may involve being wrapped for a while to bring down the swelling, then there is maintenance which can involve use of compression garments and possible use of wrapping or night garments, all of this is done with exercise as well. You need to see a qualified lymphedema therapist.

    It's not as horrible as it may sound, and treatment sure beats a swollen arm and the risk of bad infections from the swelling

    http://www.stepup-speakout.org/Finding_a_Qualified_Lymphedema_Therapist.htm

    http://www.stepup-speakout.org/treatments_for_lymphedema.htm

    Let us know how you're doing.

    Kira

  • IHOP
    IHOP Member Posts: 79
    edited January 2011

    Thanks,  I've tried the wrapping a long time ago and it was just miserible.  I was really hoping that things had improved with technology.  I guess I will learn to wrap again. 

  • kira66715
    kira66715 Member Posts: 4,681
    edited January 2011

    Darlene, I was wrapped by a Vodder certified therapist, who wrapped me so tight, my fingers turned purple and I was in terrible pain.

    Then, I found my amazing LE therapist--Vodder and Klose trained--and she creates more compression by more layers--none of this pulling tight stuff, and there are studies that show that "low pressure" wraps work as well or better than high pressure ones.

    I wrap every night--and it's comfortable.

    So, all therapists are different, and in the International Best Practics Guideline--there's a link to the huge document on the stepupspeakout.org home page, they talk about the Law of LaPlace and how to achieve the correct pressure:

    Achieving the desired pressure
    The pressure produced by a compression
    bandage can be predicted according to
    Laplace's Law (Box 24). This law shows that
    sub-bandage pressure will:
    ■ rise with increasing bandage tension and
    number of bandage layers
    ■ decrease with increasing limb
    circumference and bandage width.
    In practice, therefore, Laplace's Law shows
    that for a larger limb requiring high levels of
    compression, the desired pressure may be
    achieved by increasing the number of
    bandage layers applied and increasing the
    tension used during application 

    But, my therapist doesn't believe in excessive tension, and I completely agree with her--as she says, if it's painful, it's hurting the superficial lymphatics that are just under the skin.

    The first woman had me in tears, my current therapist is my life saver.

    Kira

  • lindee629
    lindee629 Member Posts: 61
    edited January 2011

     o k....I've worn the sleeve and glove for a while, and find that I really can manage this pretty well on my own.  The sleeve makes my hand swell, so sometimes I wear the sleeve/glove combo for most of the day and just the glove when I get home from work, and bandage at night.  And if I am going somewhere for a few hours I have gone without anything and its been ok.  Nobody seems to ask too many questions when I do wear my garments, and a few people think its carpal tunnel. I guess its not too bad. I even went to the gym today for the first time since my diagnosis a year ago, wore my garments and didn't even care who saw me or what they thought. Maybe if I can lose this 10 lbs I've put on (thanks Tamoxifen....or maybe its just from getting my appetite back post chemo haha) maybe I can help decrease the lymphedema too.  One can only hope.

  • Marple
    Marple Member Posts: 19,143
    edited January 2011

    Kira, how many wraps do you use?  Edit to add~not including fingers

  • kira66715
    kira66715 Member Posts: 4,681
    edited January 2011

    Sharon: 5 bandages total: I put gray foam on my hand and palm and I got into using a little 4 cm wrap when I was just told to wrap my hand and forearm, so first the 4 cm on the hand, then a 6 cm over that to the mid-forearm, then an 8 cm over that to the mid upper arm, and then two 10 cm wraps from wrist to axilla. Underneath it all, there's a roll of foam.

    My LE therapist always tells me that I can skip the second 10 cm, and I was getting to that point, before I broke my hand.

    So, it's stockinette, gray foam over it--held in place with artiflex, gauze finger wrap, rosidal soft foam on the arm, then the 5 short stretch bandages--and I can do in 10 minutes. My LE therapist is into layers rather than tension, and that's what I do--just enough tension to keep the wrinkles out.

    Everyone is different, and I use a lot of short stretch--lots of people would just use a 6 cm, and 8 cm and then a 10 cm.

    Kira

  • Marple
    Marple Member Posts: 19,143
    edited January 2011

    Thanks Kira.  I'll check my wraps to see the width but basically my wrap is similar to yours.

Categories