help with vit D levels

Dear Luna,

I cannot recommend anything as I am not a doctor or in the medical field. However, I bought my K2 from the Life Extension Foundation, and the recommended dosage is one tablet a day. They do not recommend K2 if you are on a blood thinner. They asked that when I ordered the K2. This is what is on the bottle:

vitamin K activity 2100 mcg....2625%

From:

Vitamin K2 (as menaquinone-7) 100 mcg

Vitamin K2 (as menaquinone-4) 1000 mcg

Vitamin K1................................1000 mcg

Here are a few articles from Life Extension on K2.

http://search.lef.org/cgi-src-bin/MsmGo.exe?grab_id=0&page_id=4098&query=vitamin%20K2&hiword=K2%20VITAM%20VITAMER%20VITAMERS%20VITAMI%20VITAMINA%20VITAMINAS%20VITAMINC%20VITAMIND%20VITAMINE%20VITAMINEN%20VITAMINES%20VITAMINIC%20VITAMINK%20VITAMINS%20vitamin%20

http://search.lef.org/cgi-src-bin/MsmGo.exe?grab_id=0&page_id=905&query=vitamin%20K2&hiword=K2%20VITAM%20VITAMER%20VITAMERS%20VITAMI%20VITAMINA%20VITAMINAS%20VITAMINC%20VITAMIND%20VITAMINE%20VITAMINEN%20VITAMINES%20VITAMINIC%20VITAMINK%20VITAMINS%20vitamin%20

http://search.lef.org/cgi-src-bin/MsmGo.exe?grab_id=0&page_id=908&query=vitamin%20K2&hiword=K2%20VITAM%20VITAMER%20VITAMERS%20VITAMI%20VITAMINA%20VITAMINAS%20VITAMINC%20VITAMIND%20VITAMINE%20VITAMINEN%20VITAMINES%20VITAMINIC%20VITAMINK%20VITAMINS%20vitamin%20

http://search.lef.org/cgi-src-bin/MsmGo.exe?grab_id=0&page_id=661&query=vitamin%20K2&hiword=K2%20VITAM%20VITAMER%20VITAMERS%20VITAMI%20VITAMINA%20VITAMINAS%20VITAMINC%20VITAMIND%20VITAMINE%20VITAMINEN%20VITAMINES%20VITAMINIC%20VITAMINK%20VITAMINS%20vitamin%20

Dear Luna,

I cannot recommend anything as I am not a doctor or in the medical field. However, I bought my K2 from the Life Extension Foundation, and the recommended dosage is one tablet a day. They do not recommend K2 if you are on a blood thinner. They asked that when I ordered the K2. This is what is on the bottle:

vitamin K activity 2100 mcg....2625%

From:

Vitamin K2 (as menaquinone-7) 100 mcg

Vitamin K2 (as menaquinone-4) 1000 mcg

Vitamin K1................................1000 mcg

Here are a few articles from Life Extension on K2.

http://search.lef.org/cgi-src-bin/MsmGo.exe?grab_id=0&page_id=4098&query=vitamin%20K2&hiword=K2%20VITAM%20VITAMER%20VITAMERS%20VITAMI%20VITAMINA%20VITAMINAS%20VITAMINC%20VITAMIND%20VITAMINE%20VITAMINEN%20VITAMINES%20VITAMINIC%20VITAMINK%20VITAMINS%20vitamin%20

http://search.lef.org/cgi-src-bin/MsmGo.exe?grab_id=0&page_id=905&query=vitamin%20K2&hiword=K2%20VITAM%20VITAMER%20VITAMERS%20VITAMI%20VITAMINA%20VITAMINAS%20VITAMINC%20VITAMIND%20VITAMINE%20VITAMINEN%20VITAMINES%20VITAMINIC%20VITAMINK%20VITAMINS%20vitamin%20

http://search.lef.org/cgi-src-bin/MsmGo.exe?grab_id=0&page_id=908&query=vitamin%20K2&hiword=K2%20VITAM%20VITAMER%20VITAMERS%20VITAMI%20VITAMINA%20VITAMINAS%20VITAMINC%20VITAMIND%20VITAMINE%20VITAMINEN%20VITAMINES%20VITAMINIC%20VITAMINK%20VITAMINS%20vitamin%20

http://search.lef.org/cgi-src-bin/MsmGo.exe?grab_id=0&page_id=661&query=vitamin%20K2&hiword=K2%20VITAM%20VITAMER%20VITAMERS%20VITAMI%20VITAMINA%20VITAMINAS%20VITAMINC%20VITAMIND%20VITAMINE%20VITAMINEN%20VITAMINES%20VITAMINIC%20VITAMINK%20VITAMINS%20vitamin%20

WOW, Nan, you certainly got your point across!    (LOLLLLLLLL!!!   :O)      ~juli

Ok how do I delete the posts, as I now have 3...not just 2? Tell me before they kick me off the site!! LOL!!

Thank you Nan!  Actually I am also a member of Life Extension and have the same K2.  Here is what has had me confused.  The bottle of K2 says 1 tablet a day.  My holistic doc says 100 to 200 mcg of K2.  But, when I talked to the Life Extension Oncology Specialist...he said 10 mg a day of K2 for breast cancer which would be 5 of those tablets of 2100 mcg of Vitamin K activity.

Maybe I need to call them back.

Just a bit more info...and I think that onc may have been wrong?

Both of the following paragraphs were taken from this link

http://www.newswithviews.com/Howenstine/james59.htm

Vitamin K2 is now available as Synergy K. One capsule of Synergy K contains 45 mcg of Vitamin K2(Menaquinone-7) and 1 mg of (Menaquinone-4 less well absorbed than K2). Natural Health Team 1-800-416-2806 can supply Synergy K. The dose should be one capsule daily (45 mcg.).

Osteoporosis

High doses of Vitamin K2(45 mcg to 90 mcg. daily) were used to successfully to treat osteoporosis[12] in Japan. These doses are 1000 times the RDA dosage. No side effects were seen. This therapy for osteoporosis should work well and using Synergy K is simpler than other therapies for osteoporosis. The addition of Vitamin D-3, calcium, magnesium, boron, strontium and silica(horsetail) will supply additional key nutrients needed to construct bone.

this following one from this link

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2008/mar2008_Protecting-Bone-And-Arterial-Health-With-Vitamin-K2_01.htm

Unfortunately, the present recommended dietary intake of vitamin K, 90 mcg/day for women and 120 mcg/day for men, may be inadequate to maintain optimal heart and bone health.4,9,19

Although vitamin K1 is rapidly cleared from the blood, K2 lingers in the blood for an extended period when taken orally and can rise to much greater levels than seen with K1. Vitamin K2 appears to be safe, with no side effects identified even at high doses. In Japan, K2 substantially improves bone density and prevents osteoporotic fractures, given either as a high-dose prescription agent (45 mg/day) or in the Japanese dish natto.7,20 Together, these findings suggest that vitamin K2 may be the preferred form of vitamin K for supplemental use.

What dose of vitamin K2 is best? Scientists are still debating this question. Supplements generally contain between 50 mcg and 1,000 mcg of vitamin K2. Even the low end of the supplement dose of 50 mcg a day may help to support healthy bone density and protect the arterial wall from calcification. Life Extension has long recommended about 1,000 mcg a day of vitamin K2, along with 9,000 mcg vitamin K1 for most people.

Well, this is throwing another wrench in treatment for my bone density loss.  I don't take any supplements except D3 (3,000ius daily), fish oil/Omega-3/9grams daily.  AND my primary doc wants me on a bone drug, yes, possibly fosomax NAN.   Boy are we all different, but sometimes the same issues.  Why question the dexa scans?  One needs to know what their bone density is?  I don't question them, just have them yearly (shows a 9+% loss since 2005, a year before dx of bc, but after parathyroidectomy in 2002).   Interesting stuff...keep it coming ladies and ty!  ~juli

Hi Nan~No, I'm not taking enough D3, that has certainly been proven now.  I don't think the dexa scans release enough radiation to be yearly harmful, certainly not as much as our yearly CT scans (chest/abdomen/pelvis) do.  When my primary doc calls, if he suggests Fosamax, I will ask for a different drug.  Don't most of the biphosphonates have phosphonate in them though?  I don't know what BHRT is, but I do know my onco does not want me on any hormones (other than the vitamin D) and Aromasin.  I certainly appreciate your research, and hope my docs do as well. We do well to have you here on the boards, thank you most kindly!   ~juli

Juli

After we got my Vitamin D3 up into the 30s, my calcium and parathyroid hormone both went down to normal.

Took months, but it made me feel so much better.

Sue

More...and all the drugs which they give for "supposedly bone loss" are all bisphosphonates. All are in the same class of drugs. It is the fact that dexa scans are really not necessary, not that they have a great amount of radiation. Weight bearing exercise is what improves bone density, along with a healthy diet and the Vitamin D3. Just read all you can juli, as the bisphosphonates stay in your body for as long as 20 years, continuing to do damage. My dentist told me that.

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/OnCall/fosamax-long-term-bone-strengthening-drug-linked-fractures/story?id=10045179

"We are seeing people just walking, walking down the steps, patients who are doing low-energy exercise," said Dr. Kenneth Egol, professor of orthopedic surgery at NYU Langone Medical Center. "Very unusual, the femur is one of the strongest bones in the body."

http://gilliansanson.wordpress.com/2007/05/09/new-danger-alert-for-fosamax-and-zometa-reclast/

http://saveourbones.com/the-truth-about-your-osteopenia-treatment/

Judy,

At the time of my breast cancer diagnosis, I had my vitamin D level checked and it was only 34.  My naturopathic doctor recommended that I take 5000 IU of Vitamin D3 daily (broken up into two dosages - 3000 IU in the morning and 2000 IU at night.  I did this for about 5 months, then she had me lower the dosage to 2000 IU daily for two months and then had my blood retested.  It was up to 111.  I have stayed on the 2000 IU daily dosage ever since and recently, over a year past the last testing, my Vitamin D level was checked again and it's still at 111.    I have been very vigilant about not missing a dose and so far, so good. 

Wow - you guys are lucky

I started at 7, and am now up in the 40s - and that took two years! 

Hate to admit it, but my endocrinologist recommends a tanning salon (actually, I went up 20 points by going to Hawaii - think I can ask for a prescription?), which is what actually sends my levels up.

ICanDoThis -- (actually, I went up 20 points by going to Hawaii - think I can ask for a prescription?)

I laughed when I read this.  I DID get an RX for this from my endocrinologist several years ago when I was first diagnosed with breast cancer.  She told me to go to the sea as often as possible.  She didn't give me an explanation at the time.  I told my husband that I really like Italian doctors and their prescriptions.  It's true too that there is much more homeopathic medicine practiced here and a national health system that supports natural remedies as a first line of defense.  That said, they are not shy to use the big guns when circumstances warrant this.  I find it to be a good balance.   

I was never one to lay on a beach ... I like to walk along the water and lately take the dog for walks along the lake.  But we don't need water to take in the sun.  Just a private place for 15 min or so.  I also remember reading that the body has an automatic shut off when the appropriate amount of Vit D has been synthesized by the body....so never too much when you take it in through the sun.

But supplements require monitoring.  I go every 3-6 months.  When I have bloods drawn for other exams, I add on vit D.  It is not covered by the national health system and I need to pay for it.  But that's fine with me.  (BTW, the ladies at the lab are my favorite cheerleaders).  We need to understand our own body rhythms for absorption because each of us are unique.  

My friend started to use a tanning bed and her sinus problems disappeared....along with the costly prescriptions for medicines to treat the sinus problems.  And when she misses her routine of the tanning bed, her problem returns.  

I've returned to adding magnesium pidolate to my routine of supplements.  This is being used in research with sickle cell anemia to control pain.  I wonder now if it is linked to the vit D levels as well and how they regulate our metabolism and proteins.  I'm not a doctor and this is much too hard to get my mind around.  But I know that magnesium pidolate does in fact help relieve my pain in joints even before I began to take increased doses of vit D and calcium.

When I was taking the recommended 400 iu .... my levels hung around 12 ng/ml ... I'm up to 28 with the increased doseage to 1200 iu per day.  I'm working at it and appreciate that it takes time for my body to adjust.  

Best wishes to all as always,

Marilyn

"Never run faster than your guardian angel can fly" 

JO-5 ...Your cousin's story is interesting indeed.

As I read her story, the first thing that came to my mind is how very individual our bodies are and how important is is to find a healthcare provider to help us monitor our needs through interval lab reports.

Then, I agree with you that there are genetics involved as well as comorbidity issues such as compromised metabolism.  This again is why one size does not fit all.

And finally, my mind wondered to the time it takes our bodies to evolve with environmental changes we make.  ... standing upright .... organs that are no longer necessary to support free range hunting, etc.  Now imagine that we are more mobile with the jet age and change habitats, even globally, within a day.  It must have an impact on the body as it adjusts.  It would seem vit D synthesis must be part of the mobility issue.  I noticed my sinus problem improved considerably when I moved here to Italy....why then not the vit D issue?  My particular problem is metabolism I think....hypothyroid.  

We are complex for certain ... glad we can share our experiences here on the boards.

Best wishes to all as always,

Marilyn 

JO-5 ...Your cousin's story is interesting indeed.

As I read her story, the first thing that came to my mind is how very individual our bodies are and how important is is to find a healthcare provider to help us monitor our needs through interval lab reports.

Then, I agree with you that there are genetics involved as well as comorbidity issues such as compromised metabolism.  This again is why one size does not fit all.

And finally, my mind wondered to the time it takes our bodies to evolve with environmental changes we make.  ... standing upright .... organs that are no longer necessary to support free range hunting, etc.  Now imagine that we are more mobile with the jet age and change habitats, even globally, within a day.  It must have an impact on the body as it adjusts.  It would seem vit D synthesis must be part of the mobility issue.  I noticed my sinus problem improved considerably when I moved here to Italy....why then not the vit D issue?  My particular problem is metabolism I think....hypothyroid.  

We are complex for certain ... glad we can share our experiences here on the boards.

Best wishes to all as always,

Marilyn