treatment decisions early stage

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I had my 2nd opinion in a large hospital by a specialist in oncology and am leaning toward radiation and Tamoxifen,his recommendation. But it is not in line with original onco recommendation of chemo(4 rounds) followed by rads and tamox. I'm inclined to follow specialist but have questions about chemo. I have read some real horror stories about side effects on here and am wondering if it that bad for all? Is there anyone with close to my stats that tolerated it and was able to work? My oncotype score was 13

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  • lisa-e
    lisa-e Member Posts: 819
    edited January 2010

    dualgate, I would be very curious why your original onco recommended chemo? With an oncotype score of 13, I believe you would get very little benefit from chemo.



    I opted out of chemo after looking at the benefits (for me, about a 3% reduction in recurrence versus 2-4% chance of having permanent side effects).

  • mmm5
    mmm5 Member Posts: 1,470
    edited January 2010

    I agree, I might get one more opinion as I understand that chemo does not work as well on grade 1. I had similar stats but grade 3 and high oncotype (with HER2) so chemo was a must.

    I don't see many ladies in your situation getting chemo, but I am not a Doctor. Did you have Vascular involvement? (it would say on your path report)

  • cookiegal
    cookiegal Member Posts: 3,296
    edited January 2010

    just a thought.....it was not so long ago that chemo was advised for everyone over 1cm...infact that's what my surgeon's pa said at my first consult.

    Unless there is a high proliferation rate or something else, It looks like chemo is no longer the standard for what you describe.

    If I had a RS of 13, I would not be inclined to do it.

  • dlb823
    dlb823 Member Posts: 9,430
    edited January 2010

    Was your original onc's recommendation made before of after you got your Oncotype-DX results?   Deanna

  • dalycity
    dalycity Member Posts: 248
    edited January 2010

    Dear Dualgate:

     I notice you are 45 years old, and probably premenopausal.  My stats are almost same as you, I was 55 years old and 1.2cm tumor. Two opinions said no chemo. I wonder if your first doc advised chemo because of your age(?) and menopausal status.

     As the other ladies here said, it would be helpful if you would scrutinize carefully all the other factors in your pathology report in order to help you make a decision.  Perhaps you may need a third opinion. You may be truly in the gray area.

  • dualgate
    dualgate Member Posts: 47
    edited January 2010

    Thank you all for your advise. I don't have any other involvement. He gave me the dx before he knew I was having the oncotype. My confidence in him isn't very good. I wanted the oncotype test and he told me It wasn't for me because it was only for postmenapausal women then came back in room a few minutes later and said yes I can have it, his mistake and signed me up for the tailorX study. Does anyone know if Dr.s get any sort of monetary gain from patients being in studies? He was really pushing me to do chemo and told me about a 29 year old who had my stats, or close to and ended up dieing and she did only rads.and tamoxifen. Kept talking about aggressive cancer at my age but only a grade 1 on path report. I don't know if he was busy or having a bad day or what... but this concerns me greatly when he is my primary onco.

  • j414
    j414 Member Posts: 321
    edited January 2010

    Dulgate,

    I'm younger than you, have a very strong family history, oncotype was 14 and my oncologist (department head at a major NYC hospital) ruled out chemo based on the size of my tumor, the grade and oncotype.  He also asked me to enroll in the TailorX, but I declined b/c I wasn't going to leave the decision to take chemo to chance.  If I were you, I would get another opinion b/c based on your stats (unless, as cookiegal pointed out, there is something else going on), you probably wouldn't derive any benefit at all from chemo.

  • dlb823
    dlb823 Member Posts: 9,430
    edited January 2010

    Dualgate ~  Have you gone to the informational side of this website yet and read about the Oncotype DX and what your results mean?   At the very top of this page, click on Symptoms & Diagnosis.  When you are in that section, search Oncotype DX, and it will give you a complete overview, including interpreting your results.  I think you will find it very helpful.   Deanna

  • dualgate
    dualgate Member Posts: 47
    edited January 2010

    Deanna, I went on the site and found out a lot of things and reviewed a lot more. Thanks for the directions to get there. Sometimes all this info can become overwhelming especially when you have 2 Dr.s giving you opposite advise. Im sure Im just going to go with rads and tamoxifen now. You all have really helped me in my decision, thank you all so much. Will keep up to date on how things are going. Thanks Jamie

  • AL1841
    AL1841 Member Posts: 28
    edited January 2010

    I am in the middle of the same decision and my oncologist at a major NYC hospital suggests CMF chemo followed by Tamoxifen.  I have the same stats as you.  Don't know your age, I have just turned 42.  One opinion, at another NYC hospital, suggested ovarian suppression with Tamoxifen and this opinion suggests CMF chemo followed by Tamoxifen.  Would love some guidance as to what to do.

  • dualgate
    dualgate Member Posts: 47
    edited January 2010

    AL I am 45 years old and isnt it crazy how you get different advise from Drs.? Above in this post a woman posted her Dr. at major NY hospital opted for no chemo for her. ?? Some times you just dont know what to do I agree!! I had a lumpectomy, no nodes were involved, er and pr+, I will have rads and tamoxifen and my oncotype dx score was 13. tumor was 1.3 cm. are your stats close to that? maybe if the nodes had involvement? Not sure dont know your exact stats? and her2-, and I had clean margins.

  • thepinkbirdie
    thepinkbirdie Member Posts: 212
    edited January 2010

    I'm 43 years old.  I think we have similar stats.  I don't remember my exact Oncotype score, but I fell into the gray area.

    I chose chemo and will start tamoxifen within the next few days.

    There are no horror stories from my chemo treatment.  Mine went relatively easy.  My hair did fall out and I cried when I had it buzzed but not because of the loss of hair... more so because I think it was facing the reality that I had cancer.  I'm actually having fun with my "bald" head...except that it gets cold!

    Everyone responds differently to treatment(s).

    Good luck with your decision.

  • AL1841
    AL1841 Member Posts: 28
    edited January 2010

    My stats are similar to Marie 317.  Marie317, did you go on CMF chemo?  That's just what I'm supposed to start on Monday.  Still can't decide on which treatment to choose.  The "little wrinkle" in all of this is that I also Multiple Sclerosis ( very mild form) but I take a weekly injection that (lucky for me) I would be allowed to stop taking during the CMF chemo.  This alone could push me in the chemo direction.  I am not hearing many people with my oncotype range and similar stats doing chemo.  Marie317:  why did you choose chemo? All of this advice is so helpful.

  • cookiegal
    cookiegal Member Posts: 3,296
    edited January 2010

    dualgate, are you in the NY area? Montefiore has an Oncologist named Sparano I think, he is a big expert in oncotype.

    CMF seems to be a popular choice for folks on the borderline. TailorX would be a really reasonable choice as well, but man you have to be brave, I have a lot of respect for the women who participate!

    I would try to get a second opinion. you need an oncologist you trust for the long haul. This may actually be more important that the treatment choice.

  • dualgate
    dualgate Member Posts: 47
    edited January 2010

    cookiegal. No I live in Iowa and have had a second opinion at the University of Iowa Hospital and Clinics ( a large well know hospital) by a oncologist specialist. He said I should not do chemo. I think I've made the decision to follow the specialist's advise. I'm going to start radiation then do Tamoxifen for 5 yeaars. He was very positive and upbeat about all this and thats what I needed. Thanks to all of you for your advise. Going to continue on with all the knowledge and confidence I can possibly muster. This is just a bump in the road and Im good at dealing with bumps!!

  • Everett78
    Everett78 Member Posts: 87
    edited January 2010

    What do you think  the oncologist will recommend for me.  I had a BMX with negative nodes, but two different types of lumps.  One mucinous and one IDC.  According to surgeon from the path report I am Stage 1, grade 2, node negative with clear margins. lump sizes 1.2 and .4mm.  They said one sentinel node showed the cancer was trying to get there but hadn't,  not metastisis, so I'm still stage 1.

    The surgeon wanted to do a lumpectomy but I chose a MX because I really felt for my situation it was the right thing to do.  He didn't think I'd need radiation or chemo and he didn't think the insurance would cover the oncotype test because of my stats

    But, now I'm stressing over what the oncologist will recommend. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

    I'm er+/pr+ and her2 neg

  • thepinkbirdie
    thepinkbirdie Member Posts: 212
    edited January 2010

    AL1841 - The chemo I had was Cytoxan and Taxotere.  My Oncotype score was 14.

    I chose to do chemo for a few reasons.  One was my age.  I thought it was best to fight this as hard as I could while I was still "young" and able to tolerate the chemo.... basically a "what if" I don't do chemo, it comes back 5 - 10 years later and I'm not in as good of health then to take on chemo.  I also wanted to make sure I did all that I could to fight a recurrence, even though I know there are no guarantees.  If I didn't do chemo, my luck is that I would have a recurrence later down the road and beat myself in the head for not having done chemo.

    It was a tough choice because I had no idea what to expect from the treatments and it's not like I wanted to experience side effects.  But it turned out to be no where near as bad as I expected.

  • AL1841
    AL1841 Member Posts: 28
    edited January 2010

    Marie317:  thanks for the response, were you offered CMF at all?  Did you explore ovarian suppressions at all or was this suggested by your oncologist? 

  • Hannahbearsmom
    Hannahbearsmom Member Posts: 431
    edited January 2010

    I have similar stats  too. I was diagnosed in 09 at age 45. I have IDC,mucinous subtype Stage 1,grade 1. Tumor size was 1.2 cm.I did not have lymph node involvement. I had a BLM--no radiation. My oncotype score was 16. My oncologist said I could do chemo if I wanted to. The change in % chance of recurrence in 10 years would only drop 10% chance to 7-8% chance. I opted not to do the chemo for only 2-3% change. The oncologist said that they don't usually really try to get someone to do chemo if there is not at least a 5% change but that I could.

    I am ER + 90%, PR + 70% and Her 2-. My BS and Oncologist both recommended tamoxifen and oopherectomy since I was premenopausal--had Bilateral ooph and hysterectomy last month. I started the tamoxifen in Oct.

    I am being seen by a breast cancer specialist at a major university cancer center. I really respect and trust my surgeon and oncologist.

    TCK

  • thepinkbirdie
    thepinkbirdie Member Posts: 212
    edited January 2010

    AL - I don't think CMF was offered to me.  Ovarian suppression?  Do you mean Tamoxifen?  If so, yes.  I should be starting Tamoxifen in the next week.

  • AL1841
    AL1841 Member Posts: 28
    edited January 2010

    By ovarian suppression I mean monthly injections in addition to Tamoxifen to suppress the ovaries and thus, the hormones that "feed" the cancer.  I'm soooo confused it's killing me.  The oncologist that recommended the ovarian suppressions said that CMF wouldn't even be good for me but that the TC/CT combo (I believe the one Marie317 is taking) would be too toxic for the stage cancer I have.

    Dont' know what to choose still.  I'm supposed to start CMF on Monday.

  • AL1841
    AL1841 Member Posts: 28
    edited January 2010

    By ovarian suppression I mean monthly injections in addition to Tamoxifen to suppress the ovaries and thus, the hormones that "feed" the cancer.  I'm soooo confused it's killing me.  The oncologist that recommended the ovarian suppressions said that CMF wouldn't even be good for me but that the TC/CT combo (I believe the one Marie317 is taking) would be too toxic for the stage cancer I have.

    Dont' know what to choose still.  I'm supposed to start CMF on Monday.

  • dalycity
    dalycity Member Posts: 248
    edited January 2010

    Dear Duelgate:  You know, you do have a slow, lazy tumor, with Grade 1. So that's a very good thing! All the best to you,

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