What is your approach/"protocol"?

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  • deni63
    deni63 Member Posts: 601
    edited November 2009

    How sad that you feel "validated" by your friend's illness. You don't sound very compassionate about what she is dealing with. But, I suppose your opinion would be that she got what she deserved. Wow. I'm real glad I don't have friends like you.

  • ChrissieD
    ChrissieD Member Posts: 36
    edited November 2009

    I use organic kelp flakes for iodine.  I sprinkle it on salads, in soup, in pasta sauce, etc.  They are organic and can be found at Whole Foods. 

    Twa, if she really is your friend you will support her decisions about treatment.  I am certain she is devestated by the news of recurrance.  Perhaps you would have made different choices had it been you who was diagnosed but it wasn't you it was your friend.  She needs your support not your opinion or to think you are saying "I told you so" or your anger and negativity.  Your rants and opinions are not one bit helpful to your "friend" or to any of us here. 

  • seaotter
    seaotter Member Posts: 1,083
    edited November 2009

    Twa, again do you have cancer. Why are you here? You have given your two cents now leave. We are already tired of your crap.

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited November 2009

    Twa 

    It's a sad day when adults reduce themselves to school yard tactics for the sick thrill of becoming cyber bullies on a breast cancer website. It would be such a disappointment to find that I have two faced friends like you who harbor toxic thoughts towards me behind my back.

    Not sure what your hidden agenda is or why you are so bitter and hateful but your approach is neither productive nor appreciated. You have crossed the line from difference of opinion to hateful and bullying so hopefully after I report you, BC.O will put and end to your days as a text terrorist.

    Carole 

      

  • Twa
    Twa Member Posts: 40
    edited November 2009

    Eff, what in the world are you talking about? Report me for what? Disagreeing with unproven alt approaches that a friend of mine bought into and it will likely cost her her life?

    I'm afraid your, and Seaotter's abusive posts are why there is a "report button."

    A friend is a true friend who will tell you the truth, not what you want to hear.

  • Twa
    Twa Member Posts: 40
    edited November 2009

    It almost seems like people are angry at me because I bring news that someone who relied on alternative treatments has had a recurrence and likely metastasis.

    If I reach one woman who comes here after diagnosis, scared of the prospect of conventional treatment and seeking an alternative, then it is worth it. The report-happy people who don't like the truth of the failure of alternative treatment can click away. The truth will not be squashed.

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited November 2010
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited November 2009

    Lucy,  my "Troll Feeding Trough" is empty and I will not refill it.  No matter how much they stand on their little troll soap boxes and scream, I will not feed them again.

    Thanks for the reminder.

    Carole 

  • althea
    althea Member Posts: 1,595
    edited November 2009

    twa, if you're trying to make friends, you have an approach that is as likeable as a barbeque wagon at a vegetarian picnic.  You're not going save me from myself, you're not going to change my mind about any of my choices, and you're certainly not going to be my friend.  You've been asked repeatedly why you're here, and you don't answer.  We all know there's no guarantees in anything we choose, whether it's hippocrates or mainstream.  Perhaps the best thing you could do for your friend is step away and tell your friend to come here where she could get some genuine support. 

  • sakura73
    sakura73 Member Posts: 467
    edited November 2009

    May I offer an outsider's perspective? It is this - holy overreaction Batman!

    The definition of troll is NOT 'someone who disagrees forcefully with my cherished opinions'.

    Twa offers a perspective you don't like, so you can tell her that (and if you look at her past posts she has indeed had cancer so she is allowed to be here, you know) but, 'text terrorist' etc seems more than a little extreme. If we are all honest we all sometimes disagree with our friends' choices and I don't see anything wrong with Twa venting a little here as part of her distress at knowing someone dear to her is ill again. 

    Meanwhile, Twa, I am sure you know that you are going too far when you say that recurrence is 'guaranteed' if you follow alternative treatments only. You can't possibly know that. I am really sorry about your friend, but one person doth not a universal truth make. I am following a natural approach in lieu of Tamoxifen (I did do chemo and radiation) and feel comfortable that it will offer me as much security as the drug would. Nothing is certain in the cancer game, unfortunately.

    This is just my opinion.

    Edited to add that athea posted while I was composing mine, and her balanced response is NOT what I was talking about when I referred to overreactions.

  • CrunchyPoodleMama
    CrunchyPoodleMama Member Posts: 1,220
    edited November 2009

    Twa, I am not angry at you or anyone else, but I'm curious why you didn't answer my questions:  Twa, I'm sorry to hear about your friend. What stage was her [original] cancer? Was it found to be ER+/PR+? Why don't you invite her to BC.org so she can get much-needed support?

    I'm curious to know the above. Without knowing any more details beyond the very barest minimum you've given, I don't see how providing a single anecdote is any better than alternative advocates who present only anecdotal evidence to support their position.

    Those of us on the alternative/complementary forum are not quackadoos who buy any snake-oil potion that comes along.

    We, like you (presumably), want HARD EVIDENCE... controlled studies... to determine what the facts are. 

    There is not "a chance" of recurrence if one seeks only/primarily alternative "treatment." It is a guarantee. However, since these people tend to stay off the grid where stats are tallied, it is not possible to point to documented proof. But it will happen.

    Ahh, it's "not possible" to point to documented proof. How convenient. The fact is, you are making a wild assertion that is completely unsupported by actual facts, aside from an anecdote here or there and your own dogged determination to hold to your Cancer-Industry-approved position.

    Eating yucky food isn't really fighting. 

    LOL... that made me giggle. In your world, eating fresh organic leafy green vegetables and other produce, wild berries and nuts and seeds, delicious herbal tea, all the foods that humans consumed back when cancer was a very unusual rarity... that is "yucky food"? What would delicious food be, then? McDonald's hamburgers and French fries? Processed packaged food stuffed with chemicals? Diet Coke?

  • Twa
    Twa Member Posts: 40
    edited November 2009

    Althea, if you are dedicated to an alternative way, you are not someone I'm really interested in reaching, if you read my post. You are not newly diagnosed, terrified of conventional treatment, and seeking information here.

    Sakura, if you did chemo and radiation (and I presume, surgery too?), then simply declining Tamox is not seeking an alternative only approach. You embraced proven treatments. There's nothing wrong with not embracing ALL of them.

    Poodle, I don't know the friend's exact pathology. She had a lumpectomy and I think SNB. The node was positive. She had a few radiation treatments and stopped. No chemo. She left the positive node in there.

    She then decided to donate thousands of dollars to the "enrich the quacks at Hippocrates Institute fund" and undertook a macrobiotic diet. I love organic leafy green stuff too, berries and nuts, seeds, and the healthiest meats I can find. But she reeks from this inedible macrobiotic stuff ... which evidently is so horrendously bland that she has found it necessary to add garlic out the wazoo to add some semblance of flavor to it.

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited November 2009

    Sakura.

    The thread topic is "What is your approach/protocol?" not  "alternative medicine does not work." Why not start a thread with that subject if the intention was truly to educate? Had a difference of opinion  been offered in a respectful, constructive manner my response would not have been "extreme" but I would have the option not to visit that thread. 

    Carole 

  • RunswithScissors
    RunswithScissors Member Posts: 323
    edited November 2009
    Twa wrote:

     ..... you are not someone I'm really interested in reaching... 

    *********************

    Attention all deluded newbies... Twa has spoken.    

    Now can we hear some more protocols?  

  • deni63
    deni63 Member Posts: 601
    edited November 2009

    Carole,

    Thanks for the heads up on the book by Dr. D'Adamo about eating for your blood type. I just found it on Amazon for $2.49 and and going to order it. Sounds like an interesting concept to me.

  • MarieKelly
    MarieKelly Member Posts: 591
    edited November 2009

    I'm really not into alternative/complementary/holistic treatment of any kind. However, since  I refused the "mainstream" prescribed treatment, I'm basically following my own kind of "alternative" approach - which is doing nothing at all beyond lumpectomy.

    So far, ( just 3 months short of 6 years since diagnosis), changing absolutely nothing about my lifestyle is working for me.  However, if I had agreed to take tamoxifen or arimidex and allowed post lumpectomy radiation, I would have never known for sure that doing nothing was a good alternative for someone like me. Worse yet, the medical minds that govern mainstream treatment decisions would be considering my recurrence free survival to date a product of those treatments. But of course, my lack of recurrence thus far is due primarily to a combination of favorable factors;1) good surgical technique, 2) the good fortune of having had a small, low grade, non-aggressive tumor and 3) the double blessing of already being in menopause at diagnosis. Nothing magical about any of it - very predictable. Hey, put me and the right number of others like me in any BC clinical trial and I can guarantee that we'll statistically help produce an overall favorable result - and the more of us the better - because we're not likely to reoccur anytime soon anyway.

    There is not "a chance" of recurrence if one seeks only/primarily alternative "treatment." It is a guarantee.

    To the person who made that statement above  -  you are making very generalized statements that do not apply to everyone with breast cancer and frankly, you don't know what you're talking about. Breast cancer is a very heterogenous disease and does not have the same prognosis and/or risk of recurrence in everyone who gets it.  The majority will not reoccur anyway regardless of what treatment they had or didn't have as long as the tumor has been excised with wide clear margins and good surgical technique has been used. Those that do have a recurrence are the exception, NOT the rule.

    I have not had a recurrence in nearly 6 years and during this time frame, I know for a fact that whether or not I took alternative therapies, whether or not  I followed all mainstream treatment recommendations and whether or not  I did a combination of both alternative and traditional treatment...I would not have had a recurrence. 

  • havehope
    havehope Member Posts: 503
    edited November 2009

    I have a question regarding supplements: how do you take them? all at once, mornings, evenings? Do you take them with food, before or after?

    I am trying to take mine ( see below) but I am a little confused on how to take them:

    Here are my supplements and foods. I don't take them everyday and I alternate. I am not on any specific diet, I eat everything (diary, meat, sugar ) in balance,  organic and grass fed. I don't eat soy.

    Cruciferous Complex (Organic):Broccoli,Cauliflower,Daikon Radish,Cabbage,Mustard,Kale

    CoQ10-100mg

    Organic Maitake Mushroom Supplements 

    Organic Green Tea (leaves) 

    Cod Liver Oil 

    Vitamin D3- 1,000 IU 

    Brazilian Nuts,Walnuts,Pecans,Hazelnuts

    Organic Dark Chocolate

    Organic Red Wine 

  • Yazmin
    Yazmin Member Posts: 840
    edited November 2009

    Twa, you wrote: "....There is not "a chance" of recurrence if one seeks only/primarily alternative "treatment." It is a guarantee"

    After talking so much and for so long in this forum, it is time, for the sake of your credibility, that you finally produce the evidence that you might have in support of such an arrogantly simplistic statement (if you should decide to do so, you will also have to destroy the evidence to the contrary, of course).

  • seaotter
    seaotter Member Posts: 1,083
    edited November 2009

    I posted this on natural girls also. I found it on breastcancerchoices.org

    Breast cancer patients may consider taking 390 mg of CoQ10, which was
    used in the Folkers and Lockwood studies on breast cancer patients.
    Since CoQ10 is fat-soluble, taking the nutrient with an oil on an empty
    stomach is recommended in order to maximize absorption.

  • CrunchyPoodleMama
    CrunchyPoodleMama Member Posts: 1,220
    edited November 2009

    Twa, I thought of you as I read the very sad story of Stefanie Spielman this evening. You said the other day:

    If you want to beat cancer, you do it with conventional methods. Running away from this truth will probably cost her her life. It was so unnecessary. 

    Conventional methods did not save Stefanie Spielman. She was 31 when she was diagnosed with breast cancer. She was wealthy, had a high-profile pro athlete husband, and the best of conventional care. She had a mastectomy within days of diagnosis, followed by months of aggressive chemotherapy. You would approve, no doubt. 

    Since she was techically cancer-free at the 5-year mark, she is a success story for conventional medicine and the statistics.

    But in my book, conventional medicine FAILED her... she had four more agonizing occurrences of metastatic cancer throughout her body, all treated with more conventional medicine, all of which eventually killed her.

    BTW, I realize chemo is the right choice for many, including several dear women here on the "altie" forum, and each of us has to make our own choices (I have no doubt it is life-saving in many cases). But, it's foolish to put blind faith in ONLY conventional medicine (unless, of course, you care only about reaching that magic 5-year mark and you're okay with dying a painful death once you've become a conventional-medicine success story) while ignoring the absolutely essential role that good nutrition, exercise, sunshine, sleep, and stress reduction have in becoming and remaining well. 

  • rgiuff
    rgiuff Member Posts: 1,094
    edited November 2009

    Carole, I also am type A blood.   Interesting theory that type As are more prone to cancers.  How many others here are type A, I wonder?

  • dlb823
    dlb823 Member Posts: 9,430
    edited November 2009

    Rose ~  I'm type A, and the diet guidelines in "Eating For Your Blood Type" make sense to me and are in line with my natural preferences and my DH's, who is an O.  But I don't recall reading anything about people with type A blood having more cancer.  Carole, is that information from the same book, or just a theory or belief expressed by your doctor?     Deanna

  • Calypso
    Calypso Member Posts: 205
    edited November 2009

    Someone posted about kelp flakes - I use them too!  They're very yummy and a great source of iodine.  

    I have a problem sometimes taking all my supplements at once - kinda makes me sick so I have to take them with food.

    TWA, do you have a protocol...?

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited November 2009

    Deanna, I believe it was my NatDocs conclusion based on the information in the book and my diet prior to being DX'd. I did get the impression that he believed that I was more susceptible because of my blood type. Thank you for asking for clarification. I will ask him more about this when he returns. It would be interesting to know which blood type is actually prone to BC.

    Hmm, here is something I just Bing'd. 

    March 10, 2009 -- People with blood types A, B, or AB are at higher risk of pancreatic cancer than those with type O, according to a new study.

    Using data from two large groups of people, Brian Wolpin, MD, of the Dana-Farber Cancer Institute in Boston, and colleagues report finding what seems to be an association between blood types and risk of pancreatic cancer.

    The study is published in the Journal of the National Cancer Institute.

    And this link to a study on BC and Type A's.

    also this "Blood type A and familial breast cancer"

    http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/112682018/abstract?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0 

    Calls for more study, very intriguing. 

    Simvog, I am trying to find out more about this myself. I posted a bit about my regimen in a prior post. A thread focusing on this would be helpful as I am sure many of us are doing different things.

    Carole 

  • althea
    althea Member Posts: 1,595
    edited November 2009

    How do y'all know your blood type?  I went through chemo, surgery, rads and tamoxifen and not one doctor during all that time ever ran a test for learning my blood type. 

  • seaotter
    seaotter Member Posts: 1,083
    edited November 2009

    I was told when I donated blood.

  • dlb823
    dlb823 Member Posts: 9,430
    edited November 2009

    I remember from pregnancy/childbirth!  You're right, Althea, it's not something any of my bc docs ever had any interest in or reason to note.  But, as Carole said, it's an intriguing question. 

  • deni63
    deni63 Member Posts: 601
    edited November 2009

    It is such an interesting theory. I looked through all of my recent bloodwork. Pages and pages of bloodwork. Not one mention of my blood type. Odd, isn't it? I do remember having a blood type card when I used to donate blood, but haven't in years and don't have the card any longer so I don't remember. I am going to ask the next time I get blood drawn if they can note the type of my blood on the results. I'm curious to see if I am type A.

  • havehope
    havehope Member Posts: 503
    edited November 2009

    I read the book and yes, the blood A is more prone to cancers of all kinds. Type 0 is prone only to skin cancer and have more of a digestive issues ( stomach and liver in particular ) but not cancer. My DH is 0, DD and I are A. As to the diet I am totally against what he is suggesting. I do not believe that a person can live healthy ONLY on fruits and veggies. I am for balance and supplements only when need it. I will not replace food with supplements. 

  • kjbell
    kjbell Member Posts: 974
    edited November 2009

    I just saw a few articles re: this and find it interesting. I am A-.

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