Campaign 2008--Let's Discuss

I found this on the Mayo Clinic website:

Here's how the morning-after pill works. Human conception rarely occurs immediately after intercourse. Instead, it occurs as long as several days later, after ovulation. During the time between intercourse and conception, sperm continue to travel through the fallopian tube until the egg appears. So taking emergency birth control the "morning after" isn't too late to prevent pregnancy.

The active ingredients in morning-after pills are similar to those in birth control pills, except in higher doses. Some morning-after pills contain only one hormone, levonorgestrel (Plan , and others contain two, progestin and estrogen. Progestin prevents the sperm from reaching the egg and keeps a fertilized egg from attaching to the wall of the uterus (implantation). Estrogen stops the ovaries from releasing eggs (ovulation) that can be fertilized by sperm.

The morning-after pill is designed to be taken within 72 hours of intercourse with a second dose taken 12 hours later. Side effects may include nausea, vomiting, abdominal pain, fatigue, dizziness, menstrual changes and headache. According to the manufacturer, the morning-after pill is more than 80 percent effective in preventing pregnancy.

There is a pill that can be taken to induce an abortion after fertilization has taken place (RU-486 mifepristone and misoprostol).

I think some people get the two mixed up.

I think I see where you're coming from, shokk (not that I agree ). What about a fertilized egg than remains unused... forever, is that ok? I hope you don't think I'm prying, I'm just interested in your line of thinking.

I guess I think that there are many ways to have children other than biological and there are so many unwanted children in this country and in the world being infertile isn't such a tragedy. If someone is going to make a good parent, is that only because they have a biological child? I don't think so. Interesting that I might be more conservative on fertility treatment that you are LOL. I don't think it should be outlawed, but I don't think tax payer dollars should go to pay for it. Let tax dollars be used to give families to children who don't have them. 

I don't think we're having a debate as much as trying to understand where each other is coming from. To me debates are aimed at swaying opinions and I don't think we're trying to do that. I admire that you are firm in your belief and that you seem to have come to those beliefs through careful consideration ,not something that was drummed into your head by someone else or because someone told you you should think that way. As I've said before, I see fertilized eggs as the potential for life and I am all for using them for research. I'm big on science and the potential for curing illness and bettering the lives of so many people much more important than a fertilized egg that may someday turn into a fetus and be born into a child. My numbers could be off, but I think I read that only 12% of fertilized eggs are actually converted into live births. To me that seems like an awful lot of waste.

A fun political day!

Obama's having kittens because McCain commandeered the word "change."  Keep them away from Palin or she might mooseshoot them!  She hates cats.

Earmarks!  A scrappy discussion is now ensuing as to whether Obama or Palin is the king (queen) of earmarks. Is Obama running against Palin now?  Jealousy? Star power waning; star power rising!

Lobbyists!  Dems say McCain has seven on his staff.  Repubs say Biden's son lobbyied his father for stricter bankruptcy rules--great for credit card companies, not so great for the average Joe, like Joe!    

Sarah--stop already with the bridge to nowhere! 

More tomorrow!  LOL 

My goodness you are all making me head hurt from thinking too much.  Normally when I think of abortion, I think of situations.  A teenager that gets pregnant.  A victim of abuse, rape, or incest.  An unexpected pregnancy in a life situation that is already intolerable. 

When we start talking about the morning after pill, then you have stirred my thoughts because I never thought that abortion would be a way of birth control.

Being in the medical field I am for stem cell research.  I do believe that is the cure to many medical problems - for example Parkinsons Disease. 

I heard someone on television that actually said birth control and abortions are a sin because it is preventing or getting rid of a life.  Birth control should not be covered by insurance, but Viagra should be as it promotes life!  This is the kind of thinking that makes me crazy.

Nicki

Nicki-- Oh, I bet a man thought up the theory about Viagra being promoted and birth control being a sin. There are a lot of sick folks out there. One of my client's mothers had 9 abortions as a means of birthcontrol. The teen wondered why her mother chose to have her and not abort her.  This woman is certainly the exception to the rule. There will always be people on the fringe who do the absurb.

I'm in favor of the morning after pill, particularly for younger women (HS and College) who might not have the assertiveness to say No when they feel sociall pressured (I'm not talking rape or date rape), though I don't think it should be taken lightly or used as birth control because if a woman can get pregnant from a sexual encounter, she can get an STD.

I'm in favor of embryonic stem cell research. Had Gore or Kerry been president, I believe that they would already have the federal funding for it. There's no proof that the artificial embryonic stem cells have the same potential as the real ones. If I'm not mistaken, several years ago McCain (reluctantly to the chagrin of conservatives) said he supported using embryonic stem cells, although he may have changed his opinion since running for president.

Obama and the Clintons: 

I try to let what was done to Hillary (sexism) and Bill (accusations of racism) go, but the Obama people keep it up.  Just heard one of Obama's people, in reference to the lipstick remark, say that Obama has to get Bill Clinton to work with him every day, as Clinton is the expert on deflecting criticism.  And he was serious!  This same man was one of those accusing Clinton of being a racist during the primaries.  I really can't take the self serving attitude of Obama's people, which makes it very difficult for me to accept their candidate. I hope Clinton insists that Obama make a public apology before he lifts a finger to help!  However, I think Clinton cares more about this country than his ego, so I suspect he will help without the apology.  

Obama is making so many mistakes now, and they all have to do with his lack of understanding of this country.  He really doesn't understand the American culture, which was first fully demonstrated when he decided to make that speech in Germany. And in my view, he also doesn't understand American liberals (I distinguish between liberal and members of the Democratic Party, although most Americans don't).  He thinks the left in this country will forgive him his right-hand turns.  Some may, most won't.  So now he's losing from both ends.  I wonder what he'll do to alienate the center.  

We shall see! 

Marin--I checked out your link.  Very funny video, yet not so funny either.  Obama and Hillary, even before the primary ended, spent more than $1 billion.  Hate to even think what the bill will be when we're finished and at the cost of everyone's integrity, including the voters.

So, an advertisement here for Nader.  He doesn't play the game but if anyone is tired of it, vote for Nader and get some real change.  it won't happen this election year but if he gets enough votes (5%+), he or his surrogate can make a difference in the next election.

Saluki- I just heard today on CNN that he has changed his mind yet again and is not supporting embryonic step cell research funding, even though he previously voted for it.

Just heard another analyst--how much money are these guys paid for saying the obvious, or in this case saying the not obvious--about the lipstick distraction, that the American Public won't be distracted by this stuff!

Please, the American Public loves this stuff and so does the media!  It's what keeps these campaigns from fading into the woodwork. 

Correction to what I wrote below:

Read in Washington Post, the following:  As has been noted many times over the past 24 hours, the phrase "lipstick on a pig" is one that the Illinois senator used on the stump before Palin was even in consideration as vice president.  If this is true and I do trust the Post, then Obama may, in fact, have slipped, so I offer this up as a refutation of what I wrote below.

I'm fixated on Obama's comment about "lipstick on a pig," not the comment itself but its genesis, and what Obama thought would happen and what actually did happen.

Obama is not a spontaneous man--from the first time I became aware of him I've viewed him as someone who thinks very carefully about every word and every move, in contrast to McCain and Biden, who both have a tendency to speak off the cuff, some times endearng themselves to their audiences and other times letting loose huge gaffes.  

My own thought is that the remark was deliberate, because Obama more than most politicians understands language; it's his claim to fame.  We see from his audience's huge reaction that they immediately equated Palin with the pig.  So why did he do it?  His campaign is very thorough in its research, and I imagine that every public speech of McCain's has been carefully vetted.  Someone probably mentioned at one of their war room meetings that Obama could throw it out there since McCain had done it first, and with reference to Hillary's health care plan. They figured it would delight their base and might also resonate with other voters. I suspect they decided that McCain wouldn't touch it because of his own use of the expression, or if he did, they could point out that it's a common expression, one that McCain himself has used.   

But the McCain camp jumped on it, probably reasoning as I have, that it was deliberate and that the voters would agree.  It's not natural for Obama to talk "folksy," so it's intuitive to the voters that it was a slam at Palin, and also at small town and rural America.  This definiely proves that Obama is not a natural politician, certainly not in the way that Bill Clinton is.  I wonder what Clinton--Bill--will demand from Obama to give him the help he so desperately needs to get off Palin and back to the issues.  Whatever the promise, I hope Bill gets it in writing!

I also find it interesting when Obama's supporters (mainly women) appear on the circuit to insist that it was not intentional--and absolutely not sexist.  They constantly mention that he has a wife and two daughters (and also a mother!).  Do any of you seniors remember "The Quiet Man" with John Wayne, and the scene in which Victor McLaughlin gives a wedding toast.  In the toast, he says of the local priest that even he had a mother, and the priest responds, "Of course, what do you expect!."  If men with wives, daughters, and mothers were not sexist, we'd never have to worry about sexism again!  For me, his sexism oozes.  Remember the "likeable enough" remark.

8. We believe in our responsibility to be disciples of Christ, to love all people and to fulfill the Commission of Christ to go and make disciples of all nations by bearing witness of Christ through life and word in the power of the Holy Spirit.

For those who don't know, the above is not a tenet of Sarah Palin's church; it's a tenet of Christianity, so that anyone who professes to be Christian is exhorted to go out and make disciples of all nations. When Barack Obama decided to become a Christian he also accepted this tenet.

Amy and Shokk...I was reading your discussion on the morning after pill, very interesting. What bothers me about these pills is that women can "think" to use this pill but cannot take early precautions, birth control (not necessarily pills). I am against abortion, always have been I know many people who have had them including family members...it just wouldn't be my choice. I am not against the right to choose, I am liberal (shudder) enough to say that but I am against abortion as a means of birth control. As I said, I know many people who have had one and went with one of those people while she had one and I can honestly say it was one of the worst experiences of my life. Girls were in there talking about this being their third and fourth time, so cavalier about it, like it meant nothing to them. I honestly wanted to get up and do bodily harm to them...the counselor that talked to the person I was with detected my moments of insanity and began counseling me...as I said it nearly drove me nuts...on the way home I had a car accident. I just don't get how people can be so irresponsible and then just go to an abortion clinic and "get rid of it..." and I know that is not always the case but I also know it is the case in a high percentage of abortions, it's just common sense, if it was truly a medical problem it would be ordered by a person's own physician and done in a hospital. Abortion clinics are there because someone was irresponsible.

Remember when McCain used the same "lipstick on a pig" comment abut two months ago and no one saw it as a sexist personal attack? Gheesh, those were the days...

I'm a female - a Black one at that - and a journalist who voted for Hillary and will support Obabma in the fall. I don't see the remark as sexist at all (how interesting is that!) - no more than I did when McCain said it. I can't believe so much attention and press ink/broadcast minutes are being wasted on this non-issue when there is a freaking war going on, the economy is in the toilet and the housing market slides into the abyss. I hope they start talking about something - anything - else real soon...

Good morning ladies............they candidates will get back on topic.........I think when McCain picked Palin the media was caught completely off guard as well as Obama and his staff.............but they will find their footing.............I will be glad when they have their first debates.........and I think tonight is Palin first interview with Charlie Gibson..............no matter how all of this plays out the next 55 days are going to be intense...........and it's going to be very close................let me ask you guys do you think that Biden will withdraw and Obama may replace him with Hillary?...........I know that these rumors are running repent on the blogs.........and if this should take place (or can it?)...........how do you supporters of Obama and the supporters of Hillary feel about it?............Shokk